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Forum Index : Solar : solar rebate
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| brucedownunder2 Guru  Joined: 14/09/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1548 |
Hi Crew ,,, just got my second 3 month electricity account.. For a total of 96 days ,my AGL provider has given me a whopping $18.02 rebate.. Thats 18 cents per day . Fact,it's all printed on my bill I'll fax it to anybody that don't beleive me. IMHO, so much for all the whoha about 1KW of ugly solar panels and all the stress that came with them. I'll be dismantling my six panels and putting them on a tracker . My average power cost is $1.90 per day ,so at least I'm happy with this. But the panels ,I'd never installed them if I knew the end result is just 18 cents per day ,what a joke. Bruce. Bushboy |
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vasi Guru Joined: 23/03/2007 Location: RomaniaPosts: 1697 |
They are good merchants, for sure. And you will not allowed to take a slice from their pie. To have your own price, you need a market full of potential clients (consumers) and to be a member of an association. To "conquer" a zone, you need good prices and your own transporting net (without that, you are "dead"). If here is only one player, you don't have a chance as a little energy producer. They pay you as a bank is doing when you change money or make money transfer, etc.. You gain very little because you use their net for delivering energy (and I think nobody said something about that). Vasi Hobbit name: Togo Toadfoot of Frogmorton Elvish name: Mablung Miriel Beyound Arduino Lang |
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| brucedownunder2 Guru Joined: 14/09/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1548 |
Good point Vasi, But what should disturb us more is the Goverment. Why can it sit back after allowing billions of taxpayers money to be allocated for these panels and then not have the guts to MAKE the provider rebate a fair price ,,,after all ,if the consumer knew he'd get a mere 18 cents a day a year ago when all the who ha was on the front pages ,he'd never had taken the bait. I reckon there will be thousands of ugly solar panels from roof tops at give away prices ,when householders wake up to this con. Bruce Bushboy |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Bruce I am finding the same situation as yourself, and it just shows the ignorance to real time power collection on behalf of the government, remember that they are basically ignorant about the tech side of the solar industry, they are only looking to placate a greeny minority to get votes next election. On the positive side before solar my electricary bill was $2400 + per annum and now it will be in credit estimated $100 per annum so that is a saving of $2500 per annum now and the way things are going you could add another 50% to that in the next couple of years. Money saved is better than money earned as there isn't tax and deduction issues related to those funds. Then comes the cost of the installation to me was $1500 and that included a new solar HWS so I am ahead $1000 in the first 12 months, that,s a lot better than bank interest on money I didn't have anyway. Oh and $50 fot the little energy meter to play with. I to am looking at a tracker system as soon as all the dust settles with the installation and metering to bring up the efficiency a bit. All the other money I have spent on my {hobby} of additional panels and windmills will be added to the energy yield in the longer term by running the house off my own system and feeding all excess to the grid. Slowly slowly catchee monkey. As you said before in your listings how if we make money from this it will be deducted from our pensions, they are pulling every penny back now as the country is broke and swinging on the apron strings of China, we are being conditioned to be the external consumers of the Chinese economy. I have just had the experience of having my property revalued and loosing half my pension due to the legislation in place at the moment and more to come they tell me. There will be a real scream amongst pensioners when this is fully implemented, not to mention the rate increases that will come with it, and the water grid cost recovery they are implementing. It seems that the only ones safe from their cuts are the ones living in a government flat with nothing else to show for their life's work, as they are now talking about stopping older people from driving as well. We must be working for independence and self sustainability as in the future we will be screwed to the wall by people { Just administrating the legislation} Also on the sale of panels it is an offense to sell the panels under your contract as the must stay for at least five years, have to let someone steal them. And they do have records of the serial numbers of every panel installed. BUGGER what a negative start to the day. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| rgormley Senior Member  Joined: 22/02/2006 Location: AustraliaPosts: 245 |
my 90 day bill came in usage $468 actual bill $43 good enough.... i say! |
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| brucedownunder2 Guru Joined: 14/09/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1548 |
Thanks for the feedback, Bob and Richard . I guess I misplaced my "cranky" pills .. I've only a 1 Kw set-up AND I notice that during the now winter months they are shaded most of the day. So I'm planning on re-locating them on a sort of tracking panel structure.. You 2 guys have much more capacity than me . I'm still fairly happy (in my case) as it's a sort of hobby for me. I'm just not happy the way the average "family" would be scratching their head about what they are getting back?. Bruce. Bushboy |
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| rgormley Senior Member Joined: 22/02/2006 Location: AustraliaPosts: 245 |
ohh and my system is 1980w (2kw) |
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MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
[Quote=Bruce]I reckon there will be thousands of ugly solar panels from roof tops at give away prices ,when householders wake up to this con. If you've ever traded stocks, you'll readily see this will sooner or later be a "BUY" situation. If it were I, I'd wait until these puppies are at give-away prices and stock up to the point of having enough home-grown electricity to be able to give the 'finger-wave' to the utility company. Now, I'm not sure of your latitude, but if it's what I'm thinking, again if it were I, I'd mount all the panels on vertical walls to protect them from the wind and rain, then use a dual-axis tracker and large mirrors to bounce the sun directly onto the panels all day long. Doing it this way, you're right up there at peak efficiency. Also, if you leave unobstructed vertical space behind the panels, as they warm up, they will create a convection current of air between the back of the panel and the wall, which will aid in cooling them. See, it's not all as bad as it looks. Just bide your time and scoop up as many "free" or nearly-free panels as you can get your hands on! . . . . . Mac Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Bruce My system is only 1000watt six panel job the other panels are on the battery system. Mi Mack Sounds feasible but would need some big time mirrors to do that but would certainly keep the panels cooler, I priced mirrors and they where more expensive than the panels. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
Bob Mirrors are free; you just have to know where to look. I've used discarded full-length mirrored closet doors that were tossed out at a remodel. All you have to do is mount the thing on a swivel base and a hinge at the bottom side, then it's just a matter of a small motor that runs the rig 180 degrees in 12 hours and a couple of small solar cells at the bottom of a long tube to track the vertical movement and you're in. The tricky part with mirrors is, you have to bisect the angle between the sun's position and your target. Here's a hint: The farther away the mirror is from the intended target(s), the easier it is to keep the track on target. That's why I'm all excited about building a simple flat-plate, all-aluminum collector using this new Durafix stuff to weld the flat aluminum tubes to the aluminum receiver, etc. I should be able to garner enough heat between 10 a.m. and 2 p.m. to make steam without even having to be concerned with any tracking. By the way, I'm not going to use "steam". I'm only going to get my working fluid up to several hundred degrees and hold it for when I need heat for hot water, cooking, distillation or whatever. . . . . . Mac Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| neil0mac Senior Member Joined: 26/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 210 |
Bruce, AGL pay the highest value (in NSW, at least = 0.68 per unit). However, they won't (reasonably) pay for power they don't receive. Did you generate more power than that? It appears that you were 'well and truly done over' by the mob that installed it - or the installer was a complete nong. |
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| neil0mac Senior Member Joined: 26/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 210 |
Old codgers (= 'very senior' members) please note that Social security count power bought as income and IF you exceed your income limit they will deduct 50% of it off your pension. But don't panic. You still have the pension plus the 'income limit' plus half your power, to play with anyway. And on top of that, you can feel proud of themselves for contributing to their own fotnightly pension. And, for thsoe who get their money on an anuual or quarterly basis, Centrelink will average the payment out over the next 'x' weeks. That is enlightening! Thanks. Now, since I plan to buy (import) my panels without a 'contract', what is my position? Still stuck with the panels being registered as part of the RECs claim? Neil. |
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| neil0mac Senior Member Joined: 26/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 210 |
Does anyone know how 'Mylar' stands up to heat? (Mylar is out of the same stable as Kevlar (Dow Corning).) Am thinking of stretching it over a sheet steel 'frame' secured around the edges. For the unitiated, I understand (from second hand experience ONLY!) that the sheet is cheap and is used by 'grass growers' to line the walls of houses covering the windows and all. Now, now, put your bongs away. |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Ki Neil My only experience with mylar is as a light aircraft covering tried in the 1980's it didnt last long in full sun less than 12 months from memory the mirrored version may last longer. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| neil0mac Senior Member Joined: 26/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 210 |
Thanks for tip. Maybe, I'll try it to test other things and replace it with mirror finish Stainless steel (at about 10 times the price) if the results warrant it. |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Neil I think the stainless steel would be cheaper in the long run as it will last for years with the odd polish, a friend of mine got some at an auction it was very thin meant for glueing to a wall or back board in a shop .016 thou I think it was may be available through shopfitters All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
[Quote=neil0mac]Does anyone know how 'Mylar' stands up to heat? I live in San Diego, CA (USA) and in 1989 the local power authority had a test facility to the east of San Diego about 50 miles in the near desert near a place called Warner Springs. They used small sections of aluminized mylar in an effort to reflect sunlight to a central focus to create power. At the time, whenever one traveled the roads in the area, the shoulders were littered with these little mylar squares; they were everywhere. That tells me they didn't hold up too well to sun or to wind. I stopped one time to pick up some just for fun and noticed that the shiny coating had peeled away and that the plastic had become quite brittle. This is likely due to UV degradation. My conclusion is that aluminized mylar will not hold up to weather, UV in particular. I know your question was about 'heat' in particular, but perhaps the heat damage is only secondary to what the UV does. That experimental station is now merely several acres of weeds, by the way. . . . . . Mac Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| brucedownunder2 Guru Joined: 14/09/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1548 |
Good morning from sunny Qld. Just did a rough comparison on the electricity debate.. Electricity $1.90 per day Petrol for car approx $7.60 per day over a 10 day period. So, thats 4 times more expensive than the power bill ,,,plus , There are a lot of other costs in running a car . So, I'm a happy Chappie ,ps,, my magic power meter says i'm using 8 cents an hour right now ,7.30am. LOL, Betcha the yank tank in the garage is costing $8 per hour standing still. Barbie today ,,hope you all have a nice day. Bruce Bushboy |
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| MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
Solar Crew As soon as this Ax-Fx build is completed, I'll put together a small flat-plate, all-aluminum solar collector and run it with oil as a working fluid. I think a lot of folks will be amazed at just how much heat can be gathered with a very small surface area when the surface absorption material and internal working fluid are each augmented just a bit. When I retire, I plan on using just such a rig for water heating, space heating and perhaps even cooking (baking). I built a similar unit 40 years ago and the thing got scorching hot in only a short 4-hour exposure time between 10 a.m. and 2 p.m. Insulation is key for these kinds of results by the way. For those who want to use destructive distillation of wood chips for manufacturing their own ethanol, I'll also show a way to make a concentrating solar oven that'll get the job done lickety-split! This project is so simple, you'd have to pay someone to screw it up, but I'll warn you ahead of time, the focused beam is enough concentrated sunlight to char (as in 3rd-degree burn) your hand in an instant. A couple words of forewarning: Be Careful! Hide and watch; coming soon to a 4m page near you! . . . . . Mac Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Neil Re your comment on the panels, From what I can find out it is for the panels supplied with the fully subsidized installation not the self supplied panels for the REC rebate. The REC scheme records all the details of the installation but doesn't seem to have serial numbers of individual panels recorded. Mack has commented on the Mylar falling to bits, that is the same as I found , it went brittle and just fell to bits. To test your Idea it would be OK for a short time, or what I did on a prototype was to use thin Gal sheet and paint it with cromebrite paint it lasted for 12 months before repaint. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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