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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : A suggestion - Pi
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| toml_12953 Guru  Joined: 13/02/2015 Location: United StatesPosts: 324 |
Stripped down like the Windows version? No thanks! It doesn't even have the MATH commands! |
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| JohnS Guru Joined: 18/11/2011 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3648 |
I suppose that version could have such things added, though I'm not sure who wants to do the work. (E.g. I could, but I don't use Windows.) John |
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Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 5695 |
Apparently there's only ncurses and pigpio added. The former lets the user write text-based user interfaces and the latter adds GPIO support. pigpio is supplied with the later versions of Raspbian and can probably be assumed to work correctly with it, no matter which version of Raspbian you are using. ncurses has been around for years and is mature software. The last stable release was in February, but it was additions and bug fixes. Stuff like that tends not to get major changes unnecessarily as they break too many things. MMBasic may require hooks into the system that aren't provided by the available, published APIs. If it does then the Pi version is stuck with having OS-specific variations and whatever restrictions are necessary to get it to run. It's the "singing dog" syndrome - you may not like the fact that it sings badly, but it's a miracle that it sings at all! :) Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| JohnS Guru Joined: 18/11/2011 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3648 |
From matherp's posts it looks like it doesn't. John |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 8563 |
Oh dear - what naivety  |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 5695 |
HeHe... I like to be optimistic. :) I'm guessing that, despite its age, ncurses is the source of most of the problems. It's the one bit that the Pi Foundation has no control over and won't be testing Rasbpian with. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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PeteCotton Guru Joined: 13/08/2020 Location: CanadaPosts: 311 |
Please take this comment with a large spoonfull of salt, as I know very little about OS programming - however, occasionally even a fool might say something wise...... What about using RiscOS as the base for the Pi based MMBasic? It is significantly faster than Linux and is at it's heart an ARM based program, and is opensource. Okay, now that I have said that, although I understand the attraction of building a faster (processing speed) and cheaper version of the CMM2, I'm not sure that it excites me in any way the same as the CMM2 does. We can all get faster computers, we can all get more advanced/modern languages, but the CMM2 and MMBasic is a stable hobbiest niche in a world of ever evolving hardware. I quite like the fact that we are all exploring and pushing this little block of hardware as far as we can. It's much the same reason that people are still writing programs for the C64 and Amiga etc. I would ask what the end game is with developing a Pi version of the CMM2? I love what matherp/Peter has done with MMBasic, and I think that now it is the best implementation of BASIC that I have ever seen. I can see an argument for starting a completely seperate project to introduce MMBasic in to the RiscOS environment (so it would still boot in to RiscOS, but have an MMBasic edit window and the ability to take over the screen). But if we were to branch the project off now, when it is still undergoing very active development, then I think it might be premature and would end up with a lot of rework and conflicts. It would be more logical to wait until Peter has the language in a semi-finished state (he is obviously still very actively evolving it), and then look at porting it to other hardware (if that is what Peter wants?). But ultimately, I guess it is what matherp/Peter's vision is for the long term. It is undeniably his baby. Does it stay as an instant on BASIC computer (the CMM2) or does it go towards a potentially larger audience of Pi users. |
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| JohnS Guru Joined: 18/11/2011 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3648 |
Sure - just rewrite all the code that needs rewriting. (I don't know if RiscOS provides the needed interfaces, though.) John |
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| PeteCotton Guru Joined: 13/08/2020 Location: CanadaPosts: 311 |
It might be more work up front, but could potentially be a more stable platform in the long term (thus making the effort worthwhile). My (limited) understanding is that RiscOS is an old fashioned 90's style home computer type operating system (i.e. no real multitasking). This "might" make it easier to get down to the underlying hardware (via drivers/API's) as the computer pretty much stops what it is doing to single execute the current program (including stopping the "operating system"). Edited 2020-11-28 05:08 by PeteCotton |
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hitsware2 Guru Joined: 03/08/2019 Location: United StatesPosts: 705 |
There is already this ... But it's bootability varies model to model . my site |
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| PeteCotton Guru Joined: 13/08/2020 Location: CanadaPosts: 311 |
Cool! Thanks. I didn't know this existed. Edited 2020-11-28 06:28 by PeteCotton |
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jirsoft Guru Joined: 18/09/2020 Location: Czech RepublicPosts: 532 |
I have worked few years with RiscOS (Acorn Archimedes A4000) and it's from my point of view very good mix of modern OS (WIMP, multitasking - partially cooperative, partially preemptive...) and almost bare metal access (writing to the screen memory, ports). Together with perfect BASIC (and be able to mix it with built-in assembler) it's really nice system... On the other side, why bother to develop MMBasic for it, when BASIC is already there? You can use GPIO, RiscOS is really fast to boot, so why not use what's already there? I don't see the reason. Jiri Napoleon Commander and SimplEd for CMM2 (GitHub), Â CMM2.fun |
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| hitsware2 Guru Joined: 03/08/2019 Location: United StatesPosts: 705 |
Exactamundo  There is Basic beyond MMBasic .... my site |
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| PeteCotton Guru Joined: 13/08/2020 Location: CanadaPosts: 311 |
I agree. As I mentioned earlier, if someone really wants to do it, then RiscOS might be a better starting point, but, I love the stability of the CMM2 as a fixed piece of hardware (400mhz / 480mhz processors aside). It feels more like we are developing on the CMM2 for the love of developing, rather than just throwing a faster processor, better graphics card etc. at the thing every few months. I would be quite happy playing with the CMM2 for another 5 to 10 years, eeking every last drop out of it that we can. |
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