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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : PicoMite: PicoGAME VGA development
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thwill Guru  Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3846 |
Hi Phil, The problem I'm trying to solve isn't putting together one or two working controllers - you can build them from scratch with a piece of perfboard and handful of through-hole components, or I imagine if you can find an existing controller that is mechanically sound it would not be difficult for several members of this board to design a replacement PCB using one or two SMD 4021's and 10K resistors on it. What I'm trying to do is identify ones that people can just buy and work with the PicoGAME without any hardware hacking. They do exist, @Saquatch and I have both received working grey "NES" ones (like those I sent to @Volhout) the problem is that the AliExpress vendors will send you these alongside cosmetically similar (but not identical) ones with sloppy directional pads and I suspect they don't even notice that they are mixing different items even within a single order. If this were a business then I suspect you could develop a relationship with one of the Chinese vendors and get them to send consistent reliable(ish) controllers. However whilst I'm finding it entertaining looking at some aspects of what would need to be done to make the PicoGAME a "product" I have no intention of getting into the business of selling hobbyist computers/electronics - looks like a very marginal business and I already have a good job with an excellent renumeration package. There is at least one cosmetically different 9-pin AliExpress NES controller yet to be tried: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32803427153.html but I'm waiting to hear how @vegipete has got on with whatever he has ordered before investing further in this aspect of the PicoGAME project. That would be "my bad", but I hate those things, and in my defence my original "new old stock" clone NES controller doesn't have any of the problems we are experiencing. Best wishes, Tom Edited 2022-08-15 01:26 by thwill Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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vegipete Guru Joined: 29/01/2013 Location: CanadaPosts: 1082 |
The NES/SNES/??? thing I bought is allegedly out there somewhere in transit. When (If) something shows up, I'll examine it and see. (Order picture was of the sort of dog bone shaped one, with GBYR coloured round buttons on the right side.) If the pcb picture is the same, changing the ucontroller inside is possible if I really detest how it functions, or doesn't. ------------- Actual nunchuck through hole jacks exist and aren't impossible to find. For example. Maybe not as plentiful and cheap as three years ago though, when I bought 20.  Visit Vegipete's *Mite Library for cool programs. |
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Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 5730 |
Ooh.... that's interesting.... Thanks. Should I resurrect the idea of a Nunchuck version? Last time I looked for those I couldn't find any. Any interest, anyone? Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3846 |
If it's this 9-pin one that I (reluctantly) "recommended" to you https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000058000550.html and you get what I got then it is an NES compatible gamepad in a SNES chassis ... the extra buttons are all just autofire A or B. With what little use I've put them to they appear to be mechanically and electronically reliable, just disconcerting because they aren't what they look like. Inside is an epoxy blob that I suspect is a 4021-ish compatible shift register plus pull-up resistors. If the one you ordered has a Nintendo bespoke 7-pin linear connector then you may end up with the SNES "compatible" ones with a micro-controller inside. @Sasquatch's experimentation suggest that these won't work with the PicoGAME, they probably need 5V. Please don't  - unless you want to.Best wishes, Tom Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3846 |
FYI now in the post ... I can't resist that steady drip of "Chinese" parcels through the door. Best wishes, Tom Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3846 |
PicoGAME VGA 1.4 (by @Mixtel90) in acrylic enclosure (by @bigmik):    My thanks to both Mick's, I am very pleased. Best wishes, Tom Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| lizby Guru Joined: 17/05/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 3015 |
I haven't looked into this PCB. What is the USB connection between the VGA connector and the power jack? PicoMite, Armmite F4, SensorKits, MMBasic Hardware, Games, etc. on fruitoftheshed |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3846 |
5V out, specifically to provide power to a VGA => HDMI adapter ... or charge your mobile phone. I believe on the 1.4 board it can be hacked to provide an alternate power in too (by convention the adjacent power jack is used), but I don't think that is so easy/possible on the 2.0 board (still unconstructed). Best wishes, Tom Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 5730 |
That's very smart, Tom. :) Upgradable to suit the latest versions too! @Lizby It's 5VDC power out. It comes from the primary regulator (if fitted) so you could, for example, power the board from 12V and get 5V for a VGA to HDMI converter. Alternatively, if you have a suitably rated supply going in you *may* be able to charge a phone from it. There's a slight voltage drop from 5V input caused by the diode though. Edit: And, as usual, I'm too slow. :) . Edited 2022-08-28 23:57 by Mixtel90 Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3846 |
Hi folks, Due to other responsibilities I'm largely on a break from the Shed at the moment but I did have a chance to test another pair of "NES/Famiclone" gamepads that dropped through the door:  These seem usable if you can put up with the gold and maroon colour-scheme. They still exhibit the "Right = 129 if you don't send an extra clock-pulse" issue that seems common to all (?) the modern clones (which is easily worked around in software, just send the extra pulse) but most importantly they do not have wonky D-pads. Internally they are the usual epoxy blob and nothing else, though for variety they have a white blob, at least the one I opened did. The listing I ordered from was: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32803427153.html But caveat emptor. Best wishes, Tom Edited 2022-09-14 01:27 by thwill Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 5730 |
Love that 70's retro colour scheme.... :) Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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Turbo46 Guru Joined: 24/12/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1593 |
@Mixtel90, Finally I want to order some of your Pico Game Adapter boards from page 15 of this post. The last photo of the board shows version 1 but the gerbers are version 0.0 (apparently). Are these the correct ones? Thanks. I may use one as part of an adapter for MMB4W to provide a games interface for the PC. I don't believe that you have done that unless I'm mistaken? Bill Keep safe. Live long and prosper. |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 5730 |
Hmmm - I've not looked at the adapter since... I'll have to look into this. My gerbers folder is empty and I can't se a SL6 file for version 1. It's probably around somewhere but I'm just not sure where at the moment. Here ya go... PicoGAME Adapter 10 construction pack.zip This should be OK. I can't find the TinyCAD schematic file - I've no idea what's happened to that. The SL6 was on my PC but not on the NAS and I don't know why not. :) Edited 2022-10-30 18:19 by Mixtel90 Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3846 |
Hi Bill, how is that going to work, MMB4W has no GPIO support. Were you going to use serial comms to a PicoMite to provide the GPIO and hence connect to a games controller ? Note that according to the documentation the olcPixelGameEngine library that Peter used for MMB4W does have (presumably USB) controller support, so it could probably be added directly to MMB4W if Peter or A.N.Other were so inclined. Best wishes, Tom Edited 2022-10-30 23:39 by thwill Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 5730 |
Port B on the PicoGAME (and the adapter) supports a COM port, if that's of use. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| Turbo46 Guru Joined: 24/12/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1593 |
I was thinking much like the controller library that you are working on: The PC would say something like: "Press the fire button on your controller". Then tell the external 'mite to decide which controller is connected. The 'mite would send ACK if and when it knows the controller type (NACK otherwise). When the game starts, the 'mite would just send a one or two byte serial code corresponding to the 'bitmap' generated by the 'mite's interpretation of the controller operation. The PC need not even know what type of controller is connected to the 'mite just that 1 represents button A or 'fire'. ' @return bitmap corresponding to current controller state: ' 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 0 ' | | | | | | | | ' | | | | | | | +-- Button A ' | | | | | | +---- Button B ' | | | | | +------ unused ' | | | | +-------- unused ' | | | +---------- Up ' | | +------------ Down ' | +-------------- Left ' +---------------- Right Its probably all pie-in-the-sky stuff and will never happen because it would require a standard approach to games. Standards don't happen in the MMBasic world because too many people have different views on how something should be done. Having said that, I have high hopes for the library that Tom is working on. Bill Keep safe. Live long and prosper. |
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| Turbo46 Guru Joined: 24/12/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1593 |
Thanks Mick, Maybe I can mount it on a sea-of-holes board with a 'mite underneath. Bill Keep safe. Live long and prosper. |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 5730 |
Or use a PicoGAME and leave off stuff that you don't want? It even fits into a case then. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3846 |
Hi Bill, Sounds like it would work (though I wonder if it would be "fast" enough), but I agree with Mick that you may as well build a full PicoGAME and just used that as the "bridge" because you are going to want most of what it provides and if you end up not using it for your original purpose you still have a PicoGAME at the end of the day. Ideally you'd want a PicoGAME that could power itself from the Pico's USB connection which I think the 1.4 PCB does (at least for me) but apocraphally the 2.0 PCB does not (I still haven't built mine). I think it probably makes more sense to make the serial connection to the Pico's USB and leave both game ports free for controllers. Best wishes, Tom Edited 2022-10-31 19:35 by thwill Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| Volhout Guru Joined: 05/03/2018 Location: NetherlandsPosts: 3534 |
Controlling picomite from MMB4W is definitely possible. This simple terminal program running in MMB4W communicates with a picomite connected via USB as COM13. open "com13:38400" as #1 do a$=inkey$ if a$<>"" then print #1,a$; l=loc(1) if l>0 then print input$(l,1); loop until a$=chr$(27) end PicomiteVGA PETSCII ROBOTS |
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