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Gizmo
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Posted: 25 March 2009 at 9:36am | IP Logged Quote Gizmo

Hi guys.

Well they have arived, my sample PVC blades. Cant wait for the weekend

These will soon be available for purchase at a very good price compared to other options. They should be cheaper than those extruded fibreglass blades, and if your timber challenged like me, a lot easier to put together.

Each lengh is 3 meters and weighs 4kg. Chord is 160mm

Exciting stuff.

Glenn








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Posted: 25 March 2009 at 9:50am | IP Logged Quote fillm

Looks promising Glenn , has a price been set yet ? ...Will be interesting to see the hub arrangement you design and their performance , do you require your piclog back ?

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Gizmo
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Posted: 25 March 2009 at 10:00am | IP Logged Quote Gizmo

Hey Phill.

No price set yet, but the idea is they will be too cheap to not consider, even for the hard core timber blade fans.

I forgot about the Piclog. Only if your finished with it, I can put another one together if I need to.

Glenn

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Janne
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Posted: 25 March 2009 at 10:50am | IP Logged Quote Janne

Wow those pvc blades look scary be interesting to see how they will perform.

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SparWeb
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Posted: 25 March 2009 at 2:45pm | IP Logged Quote SparWeb

Those look really nice. I almost want a set for myself! (No I'm too far away in Canada)

Do I see a closed cell in the trailing edge? That will help torsional stiffness. The biggest part of the torsional stiffness will still be the tube down the center and the end caps.

Very ambitious, adding a "plate" to the tip's end cap. I hope you have lots of spares because it will take a lot of testing to prove what works and by how much.

Here's some research on winglets and tip effects that I keep in my back pocket when this subject comes up:

Martin Hepperle

LTRS

The second link is to the Langley flight research technical reports. It's an enormous resource - so you could quickly drown in numbers. Obviously it's a topic that's been analyzed to death. Here's one that's readable:

KC-135 Winglet Tests

So the graphs of interest are the CD versus CL which determine output power and Cp when embodied in a windmill.


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divemaster1963
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Posted: 26 March 2009 at 12:48am | IP Logged Quote divemaster1963

wow they look good. hope they will be availbe in the us. if not hope you can look for a distributor.

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Gizmo
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Posted: 26 March 2009 at 12:56am | IP Logged Quote Gizmo

Hi John

Yes they will be available in the USA, even cheaper with the low Australian dollar.

I'm going to fit a set to my dual stator windmill this weekend, 2.6m diameter. Standard 1 inch exhaust tube will fit up the middle of these blades, and for the first 400mm from center ( most stressed part of the blade ) I'll slide in a length of 22mm steel rod. The 22mm rod is a neat fit inside the exhaust tube. I'll buy these today and post some pics as it comes together. Will keep an eye on the weight as I go.

Glenn

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Posted: 26 March 2009 at 6:32am | IP Logged Quote domwild

Great, Glenn! Now forget your job, drinking and eating and leave your wife and children so you can do lots of testing of the new blades!

Hub mounting of a formerly available extruded alu prop: The pipe of each prop was bolted via two U-bolts directly to the hub. This allowed altering of the angle-of-attack.



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Gizmo
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Posted: 26 March 2009 at 6:52am | IP Logged Quote Gizmo

Just what I was planning Dom. I'm going to use the hub I made for testing the Chinese fibreglass blades.

Makes it easy to change angle, though I think I would prefer a 3rd U-bolt for each blade.

Glenn

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Posted: 26 March 2009 at 8:29am | IP Logged Quote GWatPE

Hi Glenn,

keep an eye on the weight. Low inertia is hard to beat. My wooden blades weigh 600g each. The amount of steel and the adapters needed for the PVC ones will add up. UV protection with a decent thickness of UV block paint will add more again. I hope you can keep the weight below 1.5kg per blade.

Gordon.

PS edit : 3m for 4kg! you may be looking at up to 2kg per blade.

Edited by GWatPE on 26 March 2009 at 8:32am


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Posted: 26 March 2009 at 10:20am | IP Logged Quote Gizmo

I agree a low inertia turbine with give a small gain in a gusty location, but thats not what I wanted.

My timber blades weigh 1.2kg each, my PVC blades on the 2.6m turbine were 2.3kg each, and I had 6 of those! My Southern Cross windmill has a dozen steel blades, the whole turbine would be over 25kg. All these turbines worked perfectly well for me.

I could replace all the steel blades on my Southern Cross windmill with hand made carbon fible blades, save 10 or more kg in weight, and maybe it would pump a few more liters per day, but does that mean I should abandon the Southern Cross windmill just because its got a heavy turbine? No, because what it has works perfectly well.

Yes if I spend the time I could make a lightweight blade, but that is not what these blades were designed to do. Remember these blades were meant to be cheap, cut to length and easy to put together. We used the same profile the Windcharged turbines have used for many years, see http://www.royalfabrication.com/. The PVC used already has a good UV resistance ( I would need to contact Wes to check the exact ratings ), but yes your would still need to paint them, PVC white isn't a pretty colour.

I could have a high performance lightweight blade made, using fibreglass or carbon fibre, in a range of lengths and TSR's. But it would cost you many times what these PVC blades are worth, and you couldn't experiment with them.

These are blades for the people. If you want the best, then dont buy these, go and make your own. But if you just want a turbine thats a little heavier, a lot cheaper and easier to make, and has 80% or better of the performance, then these are a good choice.

Glenn

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Posted: 26 March 2009 at 12:37pm | IP Logged Quote oztules

Glen,
These blades seem to lend themselves to being perfect to experiment with the Jacobs pitch control... ready made for it in fact. The 1" exhaust with the 22mm down the middle for the root area, is just perfect for the beginnings of the Jacobs pitch system..... I'm starting to feel some pangs of experiment coming on


........oztules
something like this (stolen from Ronb's files) If you could con Trev into fabricating the triangle yolk, we may finally have a simple effective pitch control system for the man in the street.

Edited by oztules on 26 March 2009 at 12:51pm


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