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fifan
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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 12:03pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote fifan

Good afternoon. Sorry to my English. Do I want to ask an author why VGA an exit does not use the colors of RGB? If to apply exits that Can be separately shown out R, G, B signals. We live in 21 century and it is not needed to repeat the computers of 80th of the last century. Such computers there was a generous enough amount in our Russia. If it is necessary I can drive references to the internet, where devices are already collected destroying the coloured signal on VGA I will eat away.


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Gizmo
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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 1:01pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote Gizmo

Hi fifan

To keep it simple. Colour needs more pins and more firmware. Maximite is good because it is like computers of 80's. Easy to use, and very cheap.

Glenn

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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 1:17pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote djuqa

Exactly, it is designed to be
1/ Simple, cheap computer that can be a dedicated control computer.
2/ Easy to learn to use.
3/ Compact in SIZE
4/ Using the limited, but powerful resources of the PIC32 chip
Color needs a LOT more of the usable memory the PIC32 has.

More features = More Size , cost , difficultly in usage.
You want colour
Buy 1 of the following
1/ Desktop
2/ Laptop
3/ Android Tablet
4/ Duinomite with GameDuino Shield (Maximite compatible)




Edited by djuqa on 09 February 2012 at 1:20pm


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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 3:52pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote Olimex

Maximite does everything with just PIC32, so you have to balance the available resources.
B/W video 480x432 is remarcable result achieved just with microcontroller, I do not recall other similar project to have such resolution. And on top of this to implement so complete language interpreter.

at the moment there is only 30K left for code,adding only 8 colors i.e. 1 bit per RGB will have to triple the video memory which means no space for code and variables, so this is just not possible.

The workaround which DM does with Gameduino shield is to release the processor from the video generation and extra external memory this way you release more RAM for the language and do not bother to generate video, but this is achieved with additional cost for the Gameduino board.
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fifan
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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 5:16pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote fifan

In the former USSR at the end of the last century there was much realization of computers on the base of microprocessors of I8080 and Z80(Spectrum compatible computers). These were the coloured computers. They have an enormous amount of software. Modern technologies allow to realize any of these computers in one FPGA(exist already) and expend on making of computer in two or three times less money, than on Maximate.
I not in which case do not underestimate a value Maximate, I even wanted to buy him. But then what in him there is not a color it very unhinged me.

Edited by fifan on 09 February 2012 at 5:39pm
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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 5:43pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote djuqa

The Maximite was designed as a Hobby / Experimental / Control computer
NOT as a general purpose computer.
Most applications for the Maximite/DuinoMite do not NEED COLOUR but do need memory / IO and ease of USE.

Yes you can implement Old 8BIT Processors as a FPGA project, but would it be as useful as the 32BIT Processor that is the PIC32. I loved Z80 Processors also (IN 1989's)

Yes some people have implemented Colour PIC32 Computers,

But would it have the support/Distribution and down right Magical appeal of the Maximite or DuinoMite range of Boards.

Edited by djuqa on 09 February 2012 at 5:44pm


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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 6:35pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote Olimex

fifan wrote:
Modern technologies allow to realize any of these computers in one FPGA(exist already) and expend on making of computer in two or three times less money, than on Maximate.


DuinoMite-Mini cost EUR 19.95 retail.
Can you please send me link to FPGA project which implements Z80 or other retro 8-bit computer with keyboard, VGA support at 1/3 of this cost i.e. about EUR 6.50?
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fifan
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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 10:52pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote fifan

Olimex wrote:

DuinoMite-Mini cost EUR 19.95 retail.
Can you please send me link to FPGA project which implements Z80 or other retro 8-bit computer with keyboard, VGA support at 1/3 of this cost i.e. about EUR 6.50?

I talked about the cost of Maximite Basic SD Card Computer Kit - $89.
I have DevBoard Reverse U10. His price is 1200 Russian roubles. It is equivalent $40,43. She supports today 6 configurations real 8 bit computers. These computers use emulations of I8080/Z80 processors.
u10
Technical descriptions:
PCB size - 75 x 84 mm
FPGA - Altera Cyclone III EP3C5/EP3C10
Memory - SRAM 512KB/1MB/2MB x 8 bit & SPI FLASH 512KB/1MB/2MB
Audio codec - VS1053b Ogg Vorbis/MP3/AAC/WMA/FLAC/MIDI
Clock - PCF8583
VGA - 512 colors
Slot for SD of map
Interface of RS232
20 pin input/ouput & +5V & GND
PS/2 for connecting of keyboard & mouse.

Edited by fifan on 09 February 2012 at 11:26pm
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Posted: 09 February 2012 at 11:29pm | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote djuqa

Emulation of Intel 8080a & Z80a
With a 40USD FPGA board
Still only gives you a $40USD FPGA Dev. Board with a little software support for ZX Spectrum (which did not even have great colour support in 1980's) and other retro computers.

Versus

$89 gives you a complete functioning KIT Maximite (original Design) with Basic/Box/Support/ and is Usable.
$40 gives you a complete ASSEMBLED DuinoMite PCB with Arduino Support and Is Usable.

Both feature a REAL 32BIT Pic32 not some Emulated Bit CPU (Russia never did figure out how to make REAL z80 / 8080 CPU's)

Plus the PIC32 can also emulate Z80 but why BOTHER.

Fifan, the u10 has some application and usage, but so does the Maximite/Duinomite
The Spectrum CLONES had a lot of support in Russia, but most of the free world moved onto REAL PC's soon after AMSTRAD Takeover of Sinclair Research.
(I worked for AMSTRAD/SINCLAIR as Technical Support)

Just like the 1980's ZX SPECTRUM was only really good for games and simple programs hence the need for colour, but the MM/DM is more like a 1980 Business/industrial computer NO colour but a LOT more Processing power and FLEXIBILTY for the REAL WORLD tasks it is called upon to do.





Edited by djuqa on 10 February 2012 at 12:00am


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fifan
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Posted: 10 February 2012 at 12:01am | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote fifan

djuqa wrote:
Russia never did figure out how to make REAL z80 / 8080 CPU's

The most generous amount of clones of Spectrum was done in Russia. Did it could will happen if we did not know a device and work of these processors? Kernel of kodas of language of vhdl, that is used on u10 invented not in Russia, and in Sweden - source codes.

Edited by fifan on 10 February 2012 at 12:08am
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YT2095
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Posted: 10 February 2012 at 12:02am | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote YT2095

Dobro den moy drug ;)


I think it`s also worth remembering that the neither the Z80 or the 8080 (8085 and such) didn`t intinctively support color.
there was a Lot of analog hardware on the board of these computers such as Spectrum or trs80 etc... that enabled color output.
and although this Could technically be done on an PIC32, the pixels would be like golf balls!
yes you would only need another 3 bits to get 8 colors, but you also need the Analog hardware to impose those waveforms onto the vid signal (and in the right place), this gets Very complex!
I do understand what you are saying, and at face value it seems a relatively trivial task, I assure you it isn`t.
especially since the pic32 doesn`t inherently support Video in way of an on-chip peripheral and has to be effectively Bit banged, you`d lose running speed too, even if you could do it in 16k of Vid ram :)

Poka :)

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fifan
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Posted: 10 February 2012 at 12:25am | IP Logged Copy link to clipboard   Quote fifan

I like Your knowledge of Russian. But Poka is this farewell on great while, it is better to say Do svidanya - Goodbye.
In one of computers on I8080 parallel video memory of color is done. Data in this memory are written down synchronously with the conclusion of signal on a screen. We have(a computer is Spetsialist) 12 kByte memory with permission of screen 384 on 256 points. One color on 8 on 8 points. 16 colors are possible. Is it possible to do on Maximite?
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