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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : UltraSonic Cleaners.....
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Grogster Admin Group  Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9750 |
Does anyone have a reasonably priced one they can recommend? I am currently looking at this one on AliExpress for US$165 including DHL shipping. If I DID get this one, the very first thing that I would do when it arrived, would be to pull it to bits to check it for electrical compliance - SOME stuff out of China is nasty.... I only ever plan to use this myself, so the regulations don't REALLY apply, if I am not going to on-sell it, but I still like to know things I am going to use are safe!  Thoughts, comments, suggestions? Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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palcal Guru  Joined: 12/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2006 |
What do you want to use it for. I have one here that I have never used, the company I worked for got it as a sample for me to evaluate and I have had it ever since. It is only small and I am not sure how good they really clean. If it is suitable for what you want you can have it. Paul. Edit... just looked at the one on Aliexpress it is 3.2l the one I have is only about 1/2l I think, I would have to check. "It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all" |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9750 |
I want it for cleaning the flux and residue off PCB's once I have assembled them, to save me having to manually squirt PCB solvent on the board and then rub the crud off with paper or cotton-buds. If you can let me know the size of your one, I may be interested. Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| palcal Guru Joined: 12/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2006 |
Smaller than I thought the basket measures 130mm. x 80mm. x 45mm. deep. Paul. "It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all" |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9750 |
Yeah, too small.  Thanks anyway. Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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bigmik Guru Joined: 20/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2971 |
[Gday Grogs, QUOTE=Grogster] to save me having to manually squirt PCB solvent on the board and then rub the crud off with paper or cotton-buds. Yuk, I wouldn’t try using paper or cotton buds, they would leave fibre residue.. I use an old toothbrush and the flux remover. The remover disolves the flux instantly and the brush scrapes it away.. the brush needs to be cleaned occasionally else it leaves the board sticky, this drys after 30min in any case but a clean brush doesn’t leave the board as sticky.. Regards, Mick Mick's uMite Stuff can be found >>> HERE (Kindly hosted by Dontronics) <<< |
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| Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1667 |
Hi Grog, I've got one I bought from the gun shop; probably too small. But also built 2 of the Silicon Chip Kits, that work pretty well. Cheers Phil. |
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| Paul_L Guru Joined: 03/03/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 769 |
Hi Grogs, I wouldn't do that if I were you. The FAA banned those things from the electronic shops at Pan Am years ago. They found that they can do bad things to semiconductor junctions on the molecular level. We mostly just soaked boards in alcohol or freon solvents then used either an air blast or oven to dry them to get rid of flux and junk before coating them. PCBs that fly have a special problem. They can get very cold at high altitude and then suddenly descend into a humid jungle airstrip somewhere at which point they get saturated with condensate from the humid atmosphere, so they must be coated! For little mechanical parts ... think altimeters ... we used an old, non-ultrasonic, L&R watch master like this one. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Restored-L-R-Master-Watch-Cleaning-Machine-Cleaning-Rinse-Solutions-/142715509082 It spins the parts baskets slowly, with timed reversals, in a solvent, then a rinse, then spins at high speed to dry the parts, sometimes with a little heat. Paul in NY |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9750 |
@ Mick: Yeah, that was one of the things that was annoying me - fibres. Can you use any old toothbrush? I thought it had to be and anti-static one.... I can probably find what I need on the net. I will look into it. @ Paul_L: Yes, that is a very good point actually. Perhaps just a heated solvent bath is all I really need. I can do that locally here with a bit of this and a bit of that.... I figured the ultrasonic waves would move the crud, with the solvent softening it. A heated bath won't move the crud, so I might still need to brush the boards in the bath once they have soaked for a little while to soften all the flux crud up first.  Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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Azure Guru Joined: 09/11/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 446 |
The brush should be antistatic, but I know most people get away with using an old toothbrush. As more and more PCB's use sensitive IC's it is best to use an antistatic brush. The side effects of static damage can be delayed and very hard to pinpoint, other than things are not working as they should. The old toothbrush method was used on older PCB's that had mostly discrete components. Hopefully as people have moved onto working with more static sensitive components they have also updated all their static handling procedures including parts storage, handling and PCB cleaning. Element14, Jaycar, Altronics all sell antistatic cleaning brushes. I am sure they can be found even cheaper on eBay / Alibaba. |
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| Paul_L Guru Joined: 03/03/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 769 |
Flux crud can be hard to get off once it crystallizes. Mechanical measures are usually needed. At Pan Am I used to carry an Xacto retractable knife in my shirt pocket. http://www.xacto.com/products/cutting-solutions/knives/detail/X3209 We also had thousands of 6" x 3/8" acid brushes in stock. The bristles are a little too long and flexible for flux removal, but you can cut them down easily with a pair of dikes. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B079RKT9CQ/ref=sspa_dk_detail_0?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B079RKT9CQ&pd_rd_wg=HFkap&pd_rd_r=WQPGAYKCKH9WGW VS1FXQ&pd_rd_w=XDl3S We had one of these dispensers on every bench. You press down with the brush and get clean alcohol. https://www.amazon.com/Polish-Remover-Alcohol-Pumping-Dispenser/dp/B00CXG1OHW/ref=pd_lpo_vtph_194_lp_t_3?_encoding=UTF8& psc=1&refRID=8FJG94J1QN3MNCHTN8MV Paul in NY |
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redrok Senior Member  Joined: 15/09/2014 Location: United StatesPosts: 209 |
Hi Grogster; I have an ultrasonic cleaner that looks very similar to that Aliexpress unit. Mine is a lot older, at least 20 years old. My favorite solvent is drug store 92% Isopropyl Rubbing Alcohol. That means there is about 8% water in the mix. The water content makes the solvent, along with the metal tank, conductive enough to prevent static electricity. I have passed at least 30,000 of my solar tracker boards through it and have never had any problems. I load up about 20 circuits in the basket, heat it up to 40C and let it cook for 1/2 hour. You can see the flux moving around and dissolving into the solvent. Works like a charm. Note! I see that unit doesn't have a drain valve. I like to drain my solvent into a sealed laboratory container, Polyethylene Milk Jugs. This makes cleaning out the flux residue easier. I often use dirty solvent first, drain, then clean solvent for a final wash. Sparkly clean results. BTW, my old unit was a $30 jewelry cleaner. The ultrasonic element was low power and had no heat. I could get 2 or 3 boards in it. It did a good job but took about 1 hour or so. The problem was the clear plastic lid didn't like the alcohol and cracked and crazed. My fix was to fashion an aluminum lid which fixed the problem. The plastic body didn't mind the solvent though. It was cheap but did the job. I would recommend the jewelry cleaner for the hobbyist. I like using what is called "Acid Brushes", cheap hardware store brushes used to apply acid to solder copper tubing. The metal handle and relatively stiff plastic bristles work nicely and seem to be quite anti static, especially wit 92% alcohol. redrok |
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| isochronic Guru Joined: 21/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 689 |
AFAIK often the tiny gold wire connections from the ic pins to the silicon are bonded using ultrasonic welding..different conditions etc no doubt but .... maybe clean the pcb ultrasonically but leave the main ic to a manual step after final soldering |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9750 |
OK, so we now have some members saying DON'T use ultrasonic, and one saying they do and there is no problems.  I think I will still air on the side of caution, and go without the ultrasonic and just a heated bath. Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| Paul_L Guru Joined: 03/03/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 769 |
You can also use water and detergent or emulsifying solutions to clean up flux. I've even used a dishwasher with good results. Just make sure you rinse it very thoroughly to remove the detergent and soap and then dry it thoroughly, preferably in an oven at about 50°C with a fan for several hours, and then flush it again with a spray of alcohol. Paul in NY |
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CaptainBoing Guru Joined: 07/09/2016 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2171 |
WOO WOO WOO... THIS IS THE WORD POLICE, STEP AWAY FROM THE SCRABBLE BOARD!  Yep, alcohol scrub and then a wash in de-ionised water with a dash of plain old dish washing detergent and a rinse after is fine. GreatScott |
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| Paul_L Guru Joined: 03/03/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 769 |
@CaptainBoling -- STEP AWAY FROM THE SCRABBLE BOARD! LOL! GOOD ONE! Back in the days of vacuum tubes but before printed circuit boards Tektronix would mount most passive components on Dick Goodfellow's ceramic strips which had silver plated copper notches inserted into their surfaces using only silver solder to secure the components. This is a 1955 310a which employed John Kobbe's DC coupled unblanking circuit and Dick Ropiequet's Schmitt triggered precision wide-band calibrated linear time base generator. With the fold out chassis design they managed to stuff 30 vacuum tubes and the CRT into a cabinet measuring 6.75" x 10" x 17" weighing 24 pounds! Take a good look at one of the best electronic designs of the century! It looks like is was built by a jeweler! Pan Am had hundreds of this vintage of scopes floating around the electronic shops on their wheeled carts. The knobs were all big enough for me to grab with my big fingers!  Stuff would stick to the surface of the ceramic strips and performance would slowly degrade. When one of these malfunctioning babies arrived in a Tek repair shop they would submerge it in a bathtub filled with sudsy water for a 24 hours, then give it a ten minute shower with tap water, they a quick spray with distilled water, then a quick spray with alcohol, then 24 hours in an oven at 120°F to thoroughly dry the ceramic strips. Finally they would apply a tiny drop of Cramolin to each of the rotary switches using a very fine artist's brush. Then they would plug it in. Most of the performance problems were gone after the vacation at the spa. Today, I suspect that water filtered by the commonly available reverse osmosis filters would be sufficiently de-mineralized so that the distilled water and alcohol rinses would probably be unnecessary. Whatever you soak it in, dry it thoroughly! Paul in NY |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9750 |
@ CaptainBoing: I knew that. I was just testing ya all.  Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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