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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : Fake chips video...
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Grogster Admin Group  Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9760 |
Interesting video. Fake chips video. I think most of us already know most of this, but there are some interesting bits of extra information. Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| robert.rozee Guru  Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 2466 |
interesting indeed. i've certainly bought recycled components from china, knowing that they are recycled. precision voltage references such as LT1021 and LM399 are often recycled, to the extent that new leads have been (visibly) welded onto existing ones - with quite some expertise i might add. there are good reasons to buy 'well seasoned' devices in this case, even if brand new components are still available. however, i think a fair bit of blame should lie with the aircraft and military equipment owner when they attempt to repair electronic equipment that is over 15 years old. NO modern electronic component has a reasonable lifespan that extends beyond 15 years, and if an owner expects to maintain equipment beyond this age they should accept responsibility themselves for arranging for an upgrade path for subsystems that need servicing. this includes continuous redesign using modern components, and retirement of equipment that can no longer be maintained. it is one thing if i want to keep a 30+ year old computer running for nostalgia, quite a different thing when critical safety systems depend on antique components being within as-new specifications. now as for re-labeling components, there is no doubt that this is outright dishonest, but these sorts of dishonest practices belong in their own category. as long as a 'recycled' part is not misrepresented as something it is not (be that as new, or as a completely different part), i have no issue. cheers, rob :-) |
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stanleyella Guru Joined: 25/06/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2681 |
Does cloned mean fake? From a hobbyist view, cheaper the better.. if it works the same. Dyson parts, stuff for 2 stroke motors, a diaphragm for my toilet float filler. All "fake" :) The reality is nothing is real. |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9760 |
The video talks about fakes and clones. But no, clones are not fakes - but it depends on who you ask!  To me, a clone is a cheaper COPY of an authentic device, usually assembled with reject or otherwise sub-standard parts. They USUALLY work, but some clones can have various issues varying in severity. Take the HC12 clones for example that annoyed many of us a few years ago till we worked out there were clones on the market. They essentially worked, but were miles out of spec, so would not co-exist with genuine ones. Fake to me, is a device pretending to be something it's not. An example of that would be a chip labelled as something, but is in fact, something totally different inside - but you can't see that or tell till you test things. An LM317 regulator labelled as a LM350 for example, or parts that simply don't do ANYTHING of what they are supposed to do. I myself have used the wrong terms in the past for clone vs fake, but I now try to stick to the above, which I think is the general consensus. ...this is when members tell me otherwise!  Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| robert.rozee Guru Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 2466 |
a good example is the NS-, SE-, QT-18B20 et al. some of these are perfectly good workalikes to the DS18B20, redesigned, reverse engineered, or (i am sure) nefariously copied. and yet if you try to buy one, it is almost impossible. all the chinese ebay sellers insist on first sanding off the manufacturer numbers and printing "DALLAS DS18B20" on top! personally, i'm happy with the clones, i just don't want something that has been sanded and relabeled. cheers, rob :-) |
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Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 8304 |
The problem with clones isn't usually that they don't work, it's that they are stealing R&D cash from the developers and manufacturing profits from the licenced manufacturers. This helps keep prices for the official devices high as they are selling less. Some of the clone chips may even exceed some specifications of the originals. Unfortunately nothing can be proved as there is no proper traceability for clones, making it impossible to accept them for aerospace and military applications for example. Hobbyists don't matter. Sales to them are miniscule and there is usually only a tiny risk to life, well within Chinese H&S tolerances anyway. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| stanleyella Guru Joined: 25/06/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2681 |
My experience of mega328p and LGT8F328P. The logic green technology... luv the name, seems an improvement albeit using gcbasic and ili9341 whereas the display and touch spi work with mega328p with hardware spi, the lgt328p could only get working with software spi ie bitbanging because it was too fast?? but I talked the developer into make the display hardware spi and the touch bitbang. MMbasic and same display and touch is many times better implemented. Real world applications. |
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