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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : Microscopes
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Herry Senior Member  Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261 |
It has been suggested elsewhere that SMD work can far more easily be carried out using a stereo microscope (eg Amway). I have visited that site and there is a bewildering range of instruments available. I'd be interested to know if any forum members use one and if so: a) which one did they choose? b) do they wish they'd gone for another? c) what is the working distance like -- ie for soldering, SMD placement, large hands etc!? and d) what magnification setting was found best, and e)any other comments. So far I've narrowed down a bit. I know I want top light (adequate), I am not concerned with a camera port, and it probably has to have a boom. Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner... |
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| WhiteWizzard Guru  Joined: 05/04/2013 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2934 |
@Herry Not really a microscope, but this is the magnifier I have used very successfully for the last few years (and which has helped me assemble EVERY uM module I have ever sent out! I liked the post Grogster did a while back allowing him to take close up photos of solder work. Obviously not everyone needs to take photos but I could see the benefit. That said, I don't think I would find it too easy to assemble 'under the microscope'. Be interesting to see what people post here . . . WW |
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TassyJim Guru Joined: 07/08/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 6270 |
I have an Amscope. Grogster has one and so does Geoff. Mine was sold as one to suit stamp collectors. Best thing I ever did with my aging eyesight. I didn't bother with camera support. Low power 5X or 10 X at most. Plenty of room for the soldering iron tip and tweezers etc. Jim VK7JH MMedit |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 10251 |
I use a magnifying light like WW for soldering and then one of these to inspect/rework This microscope has been reviewed on EEVBLOG and even met Dave's standards |
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palcal Guru Joined: 12/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1989 |
I have an Amscope similar to model SKU: SE305-P. I would not be able to solder the 44 and 64 pinners without it. However I try to stick with 1206 SMD and find I can solder these with a pair of normally closed tweezers to hold the part and a head magnifier, although if I have used the scope to do the chip then I continue and do the rest. Also watch what SMDs you buy especially the caps. I find some of them only have pads underneath the ones with a full pad on the end are much easier to solder. The spring arms on the scope usually will hold the part but you have to watch what order you assemble in to make sure already soldered parts don'y get in the way. Paul. "It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all" |
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| circuit Senior Member Joined: 10/01/2016 Location: United KingdomPosts: 276 |
Nothing beats a proper stereo microscope; I would not be without mine. It is an obsolete model so there are not details available for purchase, but I selected it very carefully based on my experience with working with a wide range of stereo microscopes professionally. The best stereo microscopes I have ever used are Carl Zeiss and Leica models but these are very much top-cost models. But their most useful features are available in lesser models, therefore it is worth looking at what makes a really good device. Firstly, the optical head of the microscope needs to prism the image to the eyepieces at 45 degrees; cheap straight-barrelled devices are very tiring to use. My microscope has a working length of 95mm and I find this very reasonable. If the working length is too short then you will find that you are melting the objective lens mount with your soldering iron; too long and you will have to have your work-piece down on your knees. 100mm or so is a reasonable length. Next, magnification; I find that I set my microscope (which is a rather up-market zoom model) at x5 for most work. This gives me a 40mm diameter field of view. I probably use this for 95% of my electronics and model-making. It zooms up to x15 or switches over (automatic objective lens change) to a zoom range of x15 to x45. At this latter range one is able to examine corrosion on connectors and so forth but such a magnification is pretty useless for any manipulative work. Most of the cheaper stereo microscopes seem to offer high levels of magnification that are useless for manipulative work of the type that we do as electronic hobbyists. I have found that it is not easy to source a microscope with x5-x10 or so because most of the cheap devices are aimed at schools for looking at nature in various forms. Now, the lighting. The Carl Zeiss microscope that I used had co-axial illumination; that is there was a prism internal to the objective lens that allowed a quartz-halogen illuminator to project the light out from the objective lens. This is absolutely the best system because it is totally shadow-free lighting. I have adapted my own microscope to a "poor-man's" version; I have made a ring of 50 high-output white LEDs that I have mounted circumferentially around the objective lens. As an electronic enthusiast this should be easy for you to do and it is really worthwhile. Any single point light source, no matter how close to the visual axis of the microscope, will give you issues with shadows. Depth-of-field is a tricky aspect; basically what you are looking for is an objective lens with a small aperture combined with a very high output illuminator, but in practice you just have to take what comes. Finally, the mounting system. The ideal is to have the microscope head on an arm. The best stereo microscopes such as the ones used by museums for art restoration often have articulated self-balancing spring-loaded arms. These are fantastic but of course they are designed to move over large canvases rather than have the canvas move underneath the microscope. Cheaper stereo microscopes often have an adjustable/lockable boom arm that stands off a mounting post. This is an excellent arrangement because you have complete freedom in the work area. Avoid microscopes that have transmission illumination as well as reflection illumination. The transmission illuminator is mounted in a box beneath the observation stage and has no use at all for manipulative assembly purposes; it just adds height to the microscope and unless you are very tall with a long neck you will find that it just gets in the way of comfort. So, in summary, look for something that gives you x5 or a zoom with x5 to x15 or so of magnification; has a flat base without under-lighting and has eyepieces at 45degrees to the axis of view. Build yourself an illuminator with a ring of high-brightness LEDs and enjoy the comfort of your new workplace. You will be amazed at how much use you find for such a toy! |
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| TassyJim Guru Joined: 07/08/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 6270 |
Herry, I forgot to add that my Amscope came set up for 220/240V but used a US to AUS adapter. I hate adapters so I changed the power lead to one with an Australian plug. It has a standard transformer and the lamp is 12V halogen . Changing that to LED will reduce the heat buildup. The transformer makes a good ballast. At the time of purchase they were on sale and I paid about $180AUD including delivery. I do have a USB microscope that I use for taking pictures but hated the back-to-front nature and would miss the stereo of the Amscope. Jim VK7JH MMedit |
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| circuit Senior Member Joined: 10/01/2016 Location: United KingdomPosts: 276 |
With shadow-free lighting, proper stereo magnification and so forth, a stereo microscope makes any manipulation spectacularly easier. Compared with the large magnifying glass that you reference, you just could not believe the difference until you try it. |
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| Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261 |
Thanks to all so far. In view of the many 'scopes on the Amway site, could I ask any of you who have replied without the model number to quote it for me. So far, I have concluded that I need angled eyepieces, a reasonable working clearance, an arm mounted instrument (in case of large circuit board) and strength of up to 5 X. It is tempting to go higher, but it appears that working clearance is directly related to magnification x. Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner... |
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| circuit Senior Member Joined: 10/01/2016 Location: United KingdomPosts: 276 |
"Aging eyesight" generally means lack of accommodation in the lens of the eye; the lens becomes less flexible and reading glasses become necessary. When I was confronted with this I noted that the optician was using a computerised system for lensing up both my distance vision and reading vision. The "reading distance" is generally not adapted to the individual; it is sort of "arms-length" distance. When I work at my electronics workbench I need to be much much closer; it took a little explanation and persuasion but my optician eventually abandoned the computer lens selector and stuck a pair of old-fashioned opticians diagnostic spec frames on me and set me up with lenses focussing eight inches from my eyes with appropriate convergence of the optical centres also. The resulting spectacles give me superbly clear "youth" vision from six to twelve inches and then losing it around 15 inches. With multi-coated lenses these spectacles are a dream to work with. Be aware; the reluctance of the optician to prescribe these is because beyond a couple of feet everything becomes really blurred; the depth of field is poor and therefore I had to undertake to leave them on my workbench and not walk around in them. Nevertheless, they are simply the best when it comes to electronics and model-making. You may have trouble persuading your optician to provide these, but I could not recommend this route more highly. (Oh, and of course you will need ordinary reading glasses as well for normal use.) |
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| viscomjim Guru Joined: 08/01/2014 Location: United StatesPosts: 925 |
Hi Herry, I literally just made 10 boards with surface mount parts. I have tried many different ways to be able to see what I am doing and the absolute best thing I purchased was actually the cheapest. And it works fabulously!!! HERE is what I use to place all my parts. I also have usb microscopes, and regular optical microscopes and this cheapy thing works the best for me. That and my trusty reverse fish tank pump (vacuum). |
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| Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261 |
Oh! I've tried one of those headband magnifiers and I hated it! Horses for course I expect! Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner... |
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| Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261 |
And re opticians, I've noticed that my dentist wears a special pair of binoculars that seem to have working clearance of half a metre or so but they apparently cost $2000 + Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner... |
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bigmik Guru Joined: 20/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2949 |
Hi Herry, I use a maggy lamp similar to WhiteWizards but mine is LED illuminated.. I usually prefer my 3x glasses and use the lamp to illuminate the area I am working on as the maggy lamp is a bit `fish eyed' but it is still workable. The biggest problem I have is holding the parts still whilst soldering them.. I have tried various tweezers and clamps but depending on where the part is located these can be near useless.. I tend to hold with (my now numb) finger tips and tack one side then, when happy, remove what is left of my finger and solder the other side then go back and properly solder the tacked side... With chips I usually solder all the pins in one flow, let the chip cool and them suck up the excess solder with solder wick. Regards, Mick Mick's uMite Stuff can be found >>> HERE (Kindly hosted by Dontronics) <<< |
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| Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261 |
Re holding. So far I have only used surface mount caps and not the smallest of those. I place a blob of flux on the landing and then tack one end while holding the cap with good quality tweezers bought from the chemist (not those cheap ones from the major electronic houses). Then I solder the other end and when cooled I resolder the previously tacked end. Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner... |
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Grogster Admin Group  Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9593 |
Hi three. 
I guess you have seen the thread I posted about the one I have. You can find the thread here. This thread shows the magnification you get, the price, and a link to the scope I bought. I love my scope, and it was one of the best investments I made last year, and without it, I could not do the small SMD stuff. I solder the 0.5mm pin-pitch QFP's on the likes of the MM+ using this scope, and I do solder them 'Under the scope' to paraphrase another member. My scope came with an eyepiece cam, but it was not very good, but the scope was cheap compared to some of the exotic scopes that Amscope do, and I prefer to do the work looking through the eyepiece anyway - but that is just me - that may not actually suit you, and you may prefer to use the camera. In that case, a more expensive model with better camera setup would probably be worth the cash. In my case, with the one linked to in the other thread, I simply did not use the 20X eyepiece lenses, and essentially use the 10X eyepiece lenses permanently. With the rotatable 1X/3X objective lens, this gives you a 10X zoom for soldering, and a 30X zoom for checking your finished work. EDIT: As with Jim, I got mine from Amscope in 220v flavour, and it was supplied with an adaptor to change the plug to suit Australia/New Zealand outlets. I kept mine on the adaptor, as I never unplug it(I just move it to the back of the service desk when not in use). But it would not hurt to chop off the American plug and wire a proper Australian/New Zealand plug on the cable. Only do this if you know what you are doing with mains wiring! Using the adaptor is still safe enough, and certainly safer then chopping the plug off and fitting an AUS/NZ one if you are not sure about what you are doing! If you DO chop the plug and replace it, remember that as this is an American product, the cable will have black, white and green wires in it. BLACK IS PHASE, which is opposite to AUS/NZ's old colour code where black was neutral. White is neutral, and green is earth. If in ANY doubt, just use the adaptor. ANOTHER EDIT: I've just had a look at my scope, and they actually have used a brown/blue/green flex, which is nice - so ignore the bit about black being phase above. Black IS phase in America, but they have used a lead on the 220v version with the correct colour-code for here, which was unexpected.  Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| circuit Senior Member Joined: 10/01/2016 Location: United KingdomPosts: 276 |
Yes, a problem that I recognise...but solved by a visit to my local haberdashery. A dressmaker's thimble was the answer. These are available in a variety of materials; aluminium, ceramic, rubber...and silicone! The latter are relatively heat-resistant, flexible and really effective in helping to hold components in place. Have a dig around in Granny's sewing basket! |
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| circuit Senior Member Joined: 10/01/2016 Location: United KingdomPosts: 276 |
Yes, I have a pair of Keeler surgical loupes for surgery. These are indeed very effective but really applicable where you have to take the optics to the work as you do when operating on patients. Where the work comes to the optics the fixed bench stereo microscope is really the best idea. The other problem with the loupes is the lighting. You need a somewhat uncomfortable LED lamp on the bridge of your nose to provide the lighting - which admittedly gives superb shadow-free illumination, but the whole thing is less than comfortable to wear, especially in hot weather. When things get really serious in surgical operating (ophthalmic surgery, endodontics etc.), surgeons use stereo microscopes on articulated arms. One of the greatest advantages of not having the optical aid attached to your head is that you can move away from the stereo microscope, pick up a component in clear vision and then move back to the microscope and the working field has not shifted. I think a boom-arm stereo microscope is your perfect solution. |
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| robert.rozee Guru Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 2437 |
before commenting, i should admit that i have defective vision - a 'lazy' left eye that means i have poor 3D perception. when covering my right eye, what i see through my left eye is perfectly in focus and well illuminated, but also overlaid with complete blackness. this is just how my brain interprets the scene, and with my right eye uncovered most of what the left eye sees is usually completely ignored. with only the left eye i can barely read the top line of an eye chart, even though everything is complete in focus. it is highly frustrating, to say the least. a few times over the years i've tried to use 'mantis' magnifiers, stereoscopic magnifiers where you look into a pair of eyepieces horizontally and view an object directly below via a prism. many people have raved about how good they are. on every occasion looking into one has given me a blinding headache within a few seconds, and so i completely refuse to go anywhere near the machines now. for almost all soldering work i use a good quality BERGEON no.4422 loupe in my right eye. this has a 4" focal length (about 3x magnification) and i've found it fine for even 0402 sized resistors and capacitors. my 'odd' vision situation means that when using a loupe i do not need to close my left eyes, which probably makes it easier for me than it would be for someone with a matched pair of eyes! to hold components, i use a pair of stainless steel antimagnetic tweezers made by ERMA, type 1-SA. these are as sharp as a needle, and if you drop them on a wooden floor they embed themselves like a dart. ALWAYS wear shoes when using them! components are held in place with a flux paste, Kester SP-44. soldering is done with normal fine solder wire, which i have always found much easier to use than solder paste. for an iron, a simple weller magnastat model suffices with a 370 degree C tip of medium size. i never use fine tips as they limit speed of heat transfer. solder wick is your friend for tidying up. essentially, the tools i use are pretty simple, but of very high quality and price. i've tried cheap loupes, but found the optical quality to be inadequate. cheaper tweezers bend easily and make handling components more difficult. using just the right flux paste is like magic. and a suitably hot iron tip is paramount. but each to their own. the idea of getting a pair of glasses with a 3x right lens from an optician in an intriguing idea. for me, the left lense could be either left out completely or just flat. i might give that a go the next time specsavers have a 1/2 price examination offer (i'm due for new prescription glasses later in the year), then send the prescription off to one of the $20/pair online opticians. cheers, rob :-) |
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