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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : TZBlox product range priorities
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MicroBlocks Guru  Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
I have many Blox on my list. I need to prioritize the development and testing and would like to have feedback which ones would be in your opinion the most essential. And the ones that are missing! These three are scheduled first, only the CMM module needs to have a onboard power supply so that it can function stand alone. TZBlox POW9533 TZBlox POW9533 - A power supply input 6-9v DC output 5v, 3.3v both 500ma TZBlox MCU32MX795A TZBlox MCU32MX795A - A MCU module based on the 32MX795F512L from Microchip TZBlox CMM TZBlox CMM - A enclosure containing the MCU32MX795A module and all necessary connectors The list that needs to be prioritised contains: TZBlox BAT - A battery pack 4x AA batteries TZBlox BATLi - Li-Ion battery pack with charger TZBlox WiFiIU - A Wi-Fi module that connects through I2C or Serial TZBLOX TFT28RGB - A TFT 2.8" Color Display TZBLOX OLED9639WBIU - An OLED graphic display 96x39px White on Black TZBlox OLED6448BBIU - An OLED graphic display 64x48px Blue on Black TZBlox OLED128128CIU - An OLED graphic display 128x128px Color TZBLOX I2CI - An i2C connection module that allows hot swapping of i2c TZBlox IO16I - An IO expander for 16 extra GPIO TZBlox REL4IU - Board with 4 relais I2C or Serial TZBlox KEY4x4IUP - Small 4x4 keyboard I2C or Serial or as a matrix. TZBlox LED7SEG2x4IU - A 2x 7 segment LED with 4 digits module I2C or Serial TZBlox LED8x8IU - A 8x8 LED matrix several colors available TZBlox LEDRGB8x8IU - A 8x8 LED matrix several with RGB to have many colors *TZBlox GPSU - A GPS module and antenna Serial *TZBlox GSMU - A GSM/GPRS module Serial *TZBlox 1WIREIU - A 1wire Bus booster that allows connection of many 1wire devices *TZBlox RFID2GU - A 2.4GHZ Active RFID reader All blox will have an enclosure and male connectors for easy use while prototyping. The link of the TZBlox POW9533 shows a rendering of the top plate. It has the schematics printed so that it makes it easy to see what each pin is connected to. Obviously for complicated schematics this will be simplified as a block diagram. Plan is to make them available in kit form and fully assembled. The enclosures will be plastic or aluminum, even with T-Slot is possible. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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muddy0409 Senior Member  Joined: 15/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 125 |
Well, I'm gunna keep an eye on tx's site for more details. A bit like the Mikrobus gear by the looks. Don't poo poo conspiracy theories. Remember that everything ever discovered started somewhere as a theory. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
I have used Mikrobus and it is very concentrated on the serial busses. I am personally not so fond of 'shields', arduino shields although somewhat better included. They always have limitations unless you use 50 or more pins and once defined you are stuck with it. With Mikrobus if you need just a little different pins you are out of luck, back to make one yourself. The Arduino shields are just ridiculously big for most cases. If you make a module that needs 2 wires for the data communication and 2 for power then you don't need all the others. They just use up valuable space. It is good for sales of development boards as they can make many modules that work on all of those boards. However my 'twist' is that i want you to be able to make any combination you want and every module just has one function. When you design a project you probably start with some processor board, some breakout board, modules and a breadboard. Once you have it working the fun starts. How are you going to transfer what you have just made to a pcb. Maybe you made something that a friend also wants, or maybe even a small production run. Fun just flew out of the window. First you have to leave out all the parts that where not used on your development board, then leave out the parts you not used on the modules. Make a schematic of it, order a PCB and test it. Probably more expensive and time consuming then estimated. My 'solution' is you make a schematic of all connections you made between the 'Blox'. Then make a pcb with blox as 'tiny production module' and you have a pcb that will work first time. There would be no difference in components or connections. You just change the wires from your prototype into copper traces on a pcb. Every 'Blox' will be available as a schematic component and have a PCB pattern and footprint. Even 3d models so you can visualize how the product will look like. Each 'Blox' is an easy to use module that breaks out all the pins, easy for use with breadboarding. Inside however is the exact same tiny production module that you can use on a pcb. A next step, that needs major development on my side is that you upload a connection list (net list) between the modules and PCB's are made automagically with human supervision of course. The resulting pcb would still use the same modules only they are not on their individual tiny boards, their layout is transferred to the pcb and optimized for placement. That will take some considerable time , so in the mean time those tiny boards are just soldered on the pcb like a DIP or SOIC. The steps between experimenting, prototyping, test version and final product are very small and much less error prone. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| Nixie Regular Member  Joined: 19/02/2013 Location: AustraliaPosts: 66 |
Hmmmmm choices choices.... I like the last 4 (with asterisks) they are applicable to my interests! You may also want to consider a stepper motor controller? Cheers, Nic. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
The ones with the * are my preferences, as they are quit difficult to get in a good formfactor. I hope i have found a good source for a module. I hope it works out as i am waiting for more specifications. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| Nixie Regular Member Joined: 19/02/2013 Location: AustraliaPosts: 66 |
I have bought GPS modules from Sparkfun, Mouser Electronics and Futurelec. But I guess you probably source from China via Alibaba.com or a similar website. (I - and others!! - only get components from futurelec as a last resort, as they are so very slow to process orders.) Good luck with your developments  , Nic. |
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kiiid Guru Joined: 11/05/2013 Location: United KingdomPosts: 671 |
Good planned range
I only hope you will not run out of money (like... other people) during the development. All the tooling for these assorted boards must be a fortune... Best of luck! http://rittle.org -------------- |
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panky Guru Joined: 02/10/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1098 |
TZ, Looking good. Re your power of 6 to 9V, could you consider either a second option or modify your original to cater for 12 to 15V - this being typical power available from car, caravan, boat, rural or remote systems which (IMHO) are fertile ground for the CMM. Also, as your design seems eminently suitable for an embedded system, have you considered a mono MM Blox? Lastly, I have a requirement for a Bluetooth module and I suspect with the growth in tablets, a bluetooth link to a tablet front end for enhanced display and user interaction would be popular ( btw, I am in the early planning stages of developing an MM to tablet protocol for this purpose for my own use). Good luck - you will have an order from me when they are available. Cheers, Doug. ... almost all of the Maximites, the MicromMites, the MM Extremes, the ArmMites, the PicoMite and loving it! |
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| muddy0409 Senior Member Joined: 15/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 125 |
I certainly like the idea of "blox" type of gear. I make some gear for assorted people, usually 1 or 2 of any design. This makes design and build Very time (and money) hungry. Also old age is creeping (rushing?) up and I am rapidly thinking that a source of "lego" blocks would be the way to just get the bits together before going ahead and assembling. Will certainly make things a bit quicker. And besides, having access to the same bits off the shelf would also help with the "now, how the hell did I do that last time?" BTW.. are these modules based on a standard common sized footprint? I too am interested in the GSM/GPRS blox as I have a current project that could use one of them, or hopefully lots of them. Anyway, can't wait for more information to surface. Don't poo poo conspiracy theories. Remember that everything ever discovered started somewhere as a theory. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
I prefer to get them from a reliable source. Don't want to be short on a particular component when they are successful. That is a whole quest by itself! Sparkfun is expensive good for quirky parts, mouser no opinion, element14 is ok. I live in Thailand and most of my parts i would like to buy from Microchip or Maxim. Both have their factories close to Bangkok and i can have parts when they have them in stock and if i really really want have them an hour later. A few retailers are in 'Ban mohr' which is like a small city within bangkok that only sells electronics. Those retailers are pretty good stocked, and i can order 1 piece or a whole reel. While waiting for your parts to get picked and packed there are seats for waiting and i always end up talking to some Thais who because they have to read datasheets for a living speak very good English. My Thai is not yet good enough for conversation. 
The small shops and market stalls on the street are good for mechanical parts, like small screws, spacers etc. I never buy electronic parts from them however as i don't want to depend on a source that only sells what they have at the moment. I did find some nice switches that i needed at that time and if it is exactly what you are looking for why not, so those are guidelines not absolutes. Thank you for the good wishes. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| MOBI Guru Joined: 02/12/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 819 |
Isn't that the truth!! David M. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
Yeah, that is a concern. I invest in this adventure with a part of the money i make from my other work. I will not borrow for it, i rather go slower. Living in Thailand makes some things easy, and some things extremely difficult. There are many people that can make things, not so many that make good quality. Finding them is a slow process. I will not make the board, i have a company nearby who does that. Pick and place is in consideration. I don't need high speed, accuracy i do. If i can put in a board (paneled) load it and press a button, that would be great and save lots of time. Now it is all handwork, with some tools like camera and sliding hand rests, vacuum etc. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
Thank you! And good to hear you like the idea enough to want them. Jean Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
I think i have found a source for a combined GSM/GPRS component. It would save money and space. Waiting for a quote and minimum order amount. I not asked for a sample before i know the answers to that. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
Shipping is always the uncertainty factor. If it is in stock i see no reason that parts can not be sent of the same day or early the next day. After all it is just a pick and pack action. Maybe when they get big to fast it overwhelms them. If they are big a long time then no excuse, get your act together. Sparkfun is quick, that is the example to strive for. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
Some progress on the MCU32MX795A Module. The new schematics and some 3d renderings can be found on this URL: http://tzblox.com/Documents/_TZBlox_/MCU32MX795A I have two versions of the schematic and a third is in the works. The PIC32 has many peripherals and it is always a lot of work to find out which ones are on which pins. The "Improved" schematic organizes all the pins into "Ports". The PIC32 parts for the oscillators, power supply and MCLR# are also made into parts. This will make much more clear which pins are connected without the need to search the schematics for where it is connected to as is the case when net names are used. nets. This improved version which has even more pins broken out (AVSS, AVDD, OSCI and OSCO) will go to the PCB board maker for prototypes the first week of july. This module can be only the PIC32 with the necessary capacitors and optionally a 3.3v regulator, supervisory chip and 2 oscillator crystals can be mounted. There is a power indicator led, but if not needed can be left out. When this module is used to build a (C)MM clone the easiest is to mount all parts except the RTC crystal with its capacitors. There are two ways of powering the module, 4-6v or 3.3v. When 4-6v is used the on board 3.3v regulator supplies the PIC and has 350ma spare load that can be used for other connected circuitry. The convenience is that only one supply voltage is needed. It uses a LDO, powering from 3-4 AA batteries is possible which makes it very safe to use for experimenting. When no 3.3v regulator is mounted the module needs a single 3.3v. The PIC32 uses maximum 150ma. Note that i did not include any headers for USB or ICSP. The module will always be used on a carrier board which will include those connectors. Schematics review and suggestions are welcome. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
I got some feedback since i posted and after careful study of that feedback and the datasheet (again, but very focused on layout decision) the MCU32MX795A has gone through some major changes. I thought i was very close to a final design.  One thing was clear, the module has components on it not suited for a generic mcu board.
So i first dropped the "A" from the model number, the "A" stood for Additions. The feedback gave some real world examples that would not be possible and that was a great concern because i especially want this module to be very generic. More generic then for instance a UBW32 or other similar products. Those are always using pins for certain switches, leds, USB wired as a client, etc and are not free anymore for use. This can disqualify a module for use. Also the supervisory chip, 3.3v regulator, rtc crystal are all taken of the board as in most if not all cases these are better placed elsewhere. The more simpler, the more robust and easier to use is the new motto. For systems on a module there are other solutions currently available and that is not a part of the market i aim for. I need to remind myself of that. KISS! Components are now placed on one side, allowing it to be used much easier, even soldered directly to a board. This required a whole redesign of the board as great care has to be taken with placement of the decoupling capacitors and crystal. Official recommendations of Microchip are now strictly followed. Ground guard tracks, no crossing signal under the crystal, that sort of stuff. Although the PIC's are very forgiving and work almost all the time it never hurts to be as good as possible. I was able to keep it a two layer board that will keep costs down. I want this module to be your preferred choice instead of buying a bare chip. It will be easier to handle and takes care of the essential parts. There are now 3 optional subparts that can be left out for very specific solutions. Second and third are more an "opt-in". Those subparts are normally included because most are in almost every design. First, when you want to use the internal oscillator you can choose to leave out the crystal together with 2 capacitors. Bridging two small copper islands will connect those PIC32 pins to the connector. Second, the AVDD and AVSS are brought out straight for providing your own analog voltage and ground or with small solder bridges can use the on board resistor and capacitor. Third, there is a resistor and led for a power indicator that can be made part of the circuit by bridging, especially important if you want to run the module from a battery. Here is such a simple modification many modules currently in the market fail.
My own thoughts about laying out the PIC32 pins in a more convenient way has also been done. Pins that belong to a certain peripheral are now placed together with an added GND and some supporting GPIO. For instance the SPI peripherals are now grouped and have a fixed pin order.Having one or two gpio pins next to it that can be used as a select line will prevent long traces. Makes it much more easy to design a carrier board because all the pins needed are right next to each other. Organizing the SPI also has the added advantage that I2C,UART are organised as well because they share pins and internal peripheral. I2C has no on board pull up resistors because that will render them useless for other purposes. It will also allow for future other MCU boards to be made that use those same connector locations. Maybe a PIC32MX4 serie is enough or a PIC18 depending on your needs. Or you want an ATMega? The new PIC32MZ? Defining where all the serial ports are will make this possible. Of course a connector can never be really generic, just keeping the serial pinouts and a few gpio, analog and PWM capable pins on specific locations will allow for flexible MCU choices. It is not really a big factor as most of those processor module connector definitions do not seem to live very long as capabilities can outgrow the designers imagination very quick. The pins for JTAG and TRACE are also grouped for ease of use. All the sixteen databus pins of the PMP are next together in order and PMP control lines too. This allows for easy connection to parallel devices such as LCD, TFT or DACs. They are all on one side so placing that 50 pin header for a TFT becomes a much easier task. Also memory chips like SRAM or FRAM are easy to lay traces for. It all resulted in an even smaller board measuring 27.5x29.5 mm. It uses a 1mm grid that is much easier to solder then the PIC32 which has a 0.4mm pitch. The small size will allow very small designs and a choice can be made to go 2 dimensional by laying out the module and parts on a board next to eachother or go 3 dimensional and stack them. The 1mm grid allows for headers to be mounted to have a pluggable stackable MCU module. [edit picture added] 
It also has 4 small mounting holes that will be of great use when lining up the module for soldering. The mounting holes/pads are placed at 20mm distance and the holes have a 1mm diameter. These are pads connected to GND. They can also be used to tighten the board together when used in a stacking arrangement. Great when you use the boards in rough and shaking environments like robots, small helicopters or even your car, you can now go off-road. :) Small things like adding a big white dot to the silkscreen to make clear where pin 1 is. And there is a small line next to each tenth pin and a small dot next to each fifth to make finding a particular pin easier. I am just finishing the 3d model and when that is ready i will post the result. Remember this module is not a 'Blox' but a part of it. A 'Blox' is the prototype friendly breadboard companion with very accessible pins, the module is what is inside and what goes on your final product. It will make sure you have exact the same components on your final product as is in your breadboard version. Something all other development boards do not! Some new negotiations for the PCB manufacturer because those tolerances are tight. At least for prototypes and pools. If someone has suggestion about a manufacturer that can make prototypes that have 0.2mm traces and 0.15mm clearance i am all ears. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| StoveMan Regular Member Joined: 29/03/2013 Location: United StatesPosts: 51 |
TZ, I think you are on to something here! Every time we develop something I end up buying more functionality than I need just to avoid a custom PCB. For a focus on the embedded controller side I would keep it simple to start. INPUT >>> PROCESS >>> OUTPUT Input: Most stuff one would make with a MM would lend itself to an HMI. I find a GLCD(or TFT) much easier to program from a menuing standpoint. The money you save on a CLCD is burned up in programming time and the perceived value by the consumer is much less. Of course a simple machine with few settings is another animal (just use an Axe or stamp then!). A touch interface can be more elegant but only pays off if the intent of the product is interaction(unless we get a custom driver!). I find a directional button array or Quad encoder works best for user input. A five button remote mount BLOX (DIN) or a mech encoder with built-in counter register over I2C would be a great marriage to an LCD. What would one use a 4x4 keypad array for? Navigation? Number input? Other input is via sensors. This is well covered by most hobby suppliers; usually not much duplicate functionality. One hole I see is multiple thermocouple input though. K is king here and a good 4X interface is $$$. These are used by a lot of automotive guys as well as industry. I have used the Ocean controls shield which has the new Maxim chip (fed my a Mux of all things). It works pretty good and is the absolute cheapest thing I can find; but like you said ... a shield is huge and I only need so many seas of holes. Output: I wonder what one needs dozens of bare DIO for? They will undoubtedly go the way of the parallel port. What is simple to do from them though are relays. I wouldn't see the need to hang them off a serial bus and encode/decode the signals for 4 units. Unless TZBLOX is focused on a greater number down the road? Simple relay BLOX with protection is not sexy but if the form factor matches your system I would buy it. Just a thought about the Power BLOX. Is 500ma intended to pass power to all the BLOX one would connect? Even the Relay coils? I'm sure you have at the power budget; what is the headroom? Another hole in the MM arsenal is analog out. Lack of a bunch of easy to use hardware PWM leaves a profit center for some enterprising fellow! I2C access to a couple 0-5v(hobby)or 0-10v(industry) outputs is a solely needed product. Whose signature says that? We live in an analog world where digital... How are you all doing analog at present? One more thing: SD CARDS? Isn't the whole point with these interchangeability? For a portable device a microSD makes sense. For a machine or controller you need easy access (Anyone make a panel mount macroSD slot?). Nothing like fishing around with a pair of tweezers cause you just dropped that tiny update card down behind a 3HP motor starter while holding your goose neck flashlight in your teeth!
A board mount microSD must be mostly for storage. Why not EEPROM then? Even most laptop computers use a full size card. Probably just a pet peeve? Anyway I anticipate getting some TZBLOX! I love the idea of exploiting the benefits of the Inter-Integrated Circuit bus for a modular system! Keep us updated. Frank EDIT: I see you talked about power supply already... Sorry. |
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| JohnS Guru Joined: 18/11/2011 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3663 |
A quibble: you order some of the bits high:low (like B[7:0]) but others low:high (like B[8:13]) so maybe stick to one order. Are the DATA[0:15] what Microchip call PMD0-PMD15? Where are PMA0-15? (or PMD0-15, if the DATA ones are PMAxx)? Is there something to stop it being accidentally oriented 180 degrees around? BTW, to see the multiple functions of pins I refer to Olimex schematics as they show each function by each pin. Such as on PIC32-MAXI-WEB and Duinomite eMega. John |
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| MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
Frank, Thank you for taking the time. Much appreciated. |
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