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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : 2 new MM Plus units going crazy
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TassyJim Guru  Joined: 07/08/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 6283 |
Both the 100MHz and 120MHz versions of the chip are listed as suitable processors in the Micromite Plus manual so unless SC stated that it will be supplied with the 120MHz version, there is little to complain about. I just tested the 120 speed on my Explore64 board. It looks OK so no warranty claim for Grogster. Jim VK7JH MMedit |
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palcal Guru Joined: 12/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1993 |
SC specify the 120MHz part "It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all" |
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Azure Guru Joined: 09/11/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 446 |
If your first board was from SC as well and works at 120MHz I would add that to the info you sent them. Makes it more credible that you have built a working 120MHz unit (supplied by them) but the recent ones supplied don't work at 120MHz. |
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Grogster Admin Group  Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9610 |
All my website E64's and E100's use the 120MHz part. I keep them in their little boxes as they come from Microchip, and immediately label the top of the box so I know which speed they are. I do have some 100MHz parts, and I don't want to mix them up! Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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KeepIS Guru Joined: 13/10/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1882 |
SC only supply 120 MHZ parts. They confirmed it in their response. As I stated earlier on, my parts list from them lists the supplied CPU as a 120 MHZ part. I told them the older unit from them with identical parts (older batch of processor though) works perfectly at 120 MHZ. I'd love to hear from anyone with a recent SC kit to test it at 120 MHz, you should test it after it's been running for a minute or two as it may not show up if the CPU is stone cold. Looks like I'll have to bite the bullet and get a 120 MHz part to test it, I can't get around much because of a serious accident so it makes this very hard for me at the moment. Thanks for all the help. NANO Inverter: Full download - Only Hex Ver 8.1Ks |
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| Azure Guru Joined: 09/11/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 446 |
I have a SC Exp100 Kit but it was ordered last Oct (2017). I have a later Exp100 but I only purchased the PCB from them and the chip from Microchip Direct. |
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| isochronic Guru Joined: 21/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 689 |
A definite way to identify the chip is to use something like chipkit 3 which reports the chip version (including the silicon version number) when it connects by the ICSP at least. There are small but significant differences between silicon versions. I had similar problems with '470 ics a long time ago, I had ic's with different silicons, checking the errata helped. |
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| Volhout Guru Joined: 05/03/2018 Location: NetherlandsPosts: 5091 |
I am not sure if anyone mentioned this already, but can you check if C10 is correct? The symptoms you mention could also be caused by stability of the core voltage regulator (internal 1.8V). You could simply parallel another 10uF ceramic capacitor to it (not electrolytical). Volhout The capacitor at the Vcap pin should be minimum 8uF and 3 ohm max ESR. It is possible that due to spread in component tolerances this is critical on your board.  Ceramic capacitors typically are +/- 20%, so 8uF is within possible values of a 10uF capacitor. If you don't have one, take the one from the second board. PicomiteVGA PETSCII ROBOTS |
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| KeepIS Guru Joined: 13/10/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1882 |
Thanks, that was the first thing I thought of, it means that both new boards would have had to be supplied with a faulty or incorrect part, I find that unlikely, unfortunately due to a serious accident I'm in no position mentally or physically to keep at this. I will just have to accept what I was supplied with and test them at 100 MHz in the CNC device I designed, hopefully it will be ok. Thanks again for suggestions. NANO Inverter: Full download - Only Hex Ver 8.1Ks |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9610 |
I know you are obviously in a hard place right now, but remember: we are here to help you.  Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| Azure Guru Joined: 09/11/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 446 |
I did check the Errata sheet (as suggested in an earlier post) early on in this post while trying to figure out if it could help identify the CPU speed. Sadly the Errata sheet and the silicon revision provides no additional clues about the chip speed. In fact according to the current Errata sheet the PIC32MX470's are still on original silicon rev A0, while other PIC32MX series have moved onto A1 and B0 revisions. |
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| KeepIS Guru Joined: 13/10/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1882 |
When I got the first kit a year or so back, I programmed the firmware with my PICkit3. NOTE Device selected is PIC32MX470F512L Just tried to read the chip and I get: Connecting to MPLAB PICkit 3... Currently loaded firmware on PICkit 3 Firmware Suite Version.....01.49.09 Firmware type..............PIC32MX Invalid command response (sent 0x63, received 0x3f) Connection Failed. NOTE: Plugged it into the old MM plus and I get the same error. 1: Using external power as I always have. 2: Yes it's plugged in the correct way. 3: PK3 was still programmed from the last time I used it for this chip. That's the same error as not plugging the PK3 into the ICSP header. Obviously the header works as I programmed these with new firmware using the Microbridge. I think I'll give up. NANO Inverter: Full download - Only Hex Ver 8.1Ks |
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| isochronic Guru Joined: 21/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 689 |
hmmm. My bad, mucho apologetico.... bit puzzled though, there was definitely some hassle in that area. Something to do with clock startup and changeover not reliable (??) and register etc. I will try to dig it up. Sorry that does not help much. It is a bit strange the pickit3 will not see the original board ic ok. The ICSP/chipkit3 connection is affected by stray capacitance badly at higher frequencies, I guess you already have tried it but it is worth using pins close to the IC instead of a connector cable. I had a short 6 wire cable ca 12cm, it worked ok at the 50 Mz ranges but was no-go at the 100 and up. |
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| isochronic Guru Joined: 21/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 689 |
The problem is occurring elsewhere - check here . It looks like a 100 Mz ic  |
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| Azure Guru Joined: 09/11/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 446 |
@Chronic, There are several errata in relation to the chip but nothing to do with cpu clock speed that I noticed when reading through them and sadly with no rev change nothing that tells a 100MHz from a 120MHz part. Edit: That post is interesting, so Microchip could check the trace code to see what it is supposed to be. I wonder if they get many support questions about that. All because they didn't bother to identify parts that you specifically order and pay different prices for with different part numbers on the chip. @KeepIS Don't give up, take a timeout (for sanity and the sake of the board remaining in one piece), put it aside and come back to it in a few days. You probably have already done this but just in case (to keep eliminating things), did you program it with just the EXP100 PCB, no LCD, no option boards (Clicks, RTC) and nothing connected to any port pins? The interface for the Pickit and 1454/1544 Microbridge use different interface circuitry so while they both can program the chip through the ICSP port they are not the same circuits. I just checked the SC EXP100 Schematic and ICSP PGC and PGD are shared with conn 8 expansion connector pins 29 and 31. PGD also connects to JP3 and JP5 so they can be connected to the MikroBUS Click board Tx/Rd pins. These could cause issues for the ICSP port. |
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| KeepIS Guru Joined: 13/10/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1882 |
Thank you, I'm going to email that link to SC. That is exactly what is happening to mine, interesting looking at the production date on the processor posted in the link. Mine are 1743QC7 his are 1743Q67. NANO Inverter: Full download - Only Hex Ver 8.1Ks |
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| KeepIS Guru Joined: 13/10/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1882 |
Thanks, not likely to spit the dummy over the boards, it's just this life changing injury making everything just to hard to deal with. I have an extensive background in electronics so I know all the traps and all of the above have been done, but again thanks for the suggestions as any of those could cause a problem. NANO Inverter: Full download - Only Hex Ver 8.1Ks |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9610 |
From the external link to the Microchip Forums posted by chronic: [Quote=Microchip Forums(Larry Standage)]The Product Identification System page is more for ordering information, and, unfortunately, has less to do with what is marked on the part. I actually had some strongly-worded emails with the production team about putting the speed markings on the parts. Historically, prior to the 430/450/470 family, we put the speed on the part. However, they decided not to do it with this family onwards. I didn't like that, because I thought this very problem would come up. But I was basically tilting against windmills at that point. The temp range is a bit of a giveaway, as the 120MHz is only available in the Commercial (0-70) temp range.[/Quote] Hard to believe in this day and age, eh?  Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| KeepIS Guru Joined: 13/10/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1882 |
Totally agree, this is a **** Joke. I sent another email off to SC with the link and the quote that Groster posted highlighted in the vain hope it might prompt them to actually read it. I don't think SC will do anything, I'd love to be wrong. I'm glad I spent a few days working out how to decode and control the Digital scale slides (almost gave up), I spent a lot more time than I would normally in programming the Clock and decode functions in an attempt to mitigate the timing delay introduced by the basic interpreter overhead. I managed to get it to run down to 80 MHz, yesterday I set the prototype to 100 MHz and tested it in the machine, it appears to work perfectly although I can't do much for another two months due to my %^&* injury. NANO Inverter: Full download - Only Hex Ver 8.1Ks |
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| KeepIS Guru Joined: 13/10/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1882 |
Just got a reply from SC, they are going to contact Microchip and see what they say, Can't ask for much more from SC, likely Microchip will just fob them off anyway. NANO Inverter: Full download - Only Hex Ver 8.1Ks |
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