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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : Recommend a PCB Layout Tool for a newbie?

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palcal

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Joined: 12/10/2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 1982

Posted: 08:35pm 08 Dec 2012

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Thanks Vasi, will do that. Maybe you can help with a problem I have with DipTrace.
The Data file disappears every time I switch the computer off, so I am unable to use the Sheet Templates. The file is in all users/application files/ diptrace/data. I think the relevant files are stamps.dat and pagestand .dat. They download as DVD video files which seems a bit odd.I have now put the file on a USB drive and reload it when needed.

"It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all"

MicroBlocks

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Joined: 12/05/2012
Location: Thailand
Posts: 2209

Posted: 08:55pm 08 Dec 2012

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I checked in my directory and they are there together with a bunch of others.
The modified date is in the year 2004 which suggest that these files are only read.
You might try to make them read only by right clicking them and check the box next to "read only"

That they are shown as DVD video is because a program is associated with the .dat extension.

You can remove that association as shown here for windows 7:
http://helpdeskgeek.com/windows-7/remove-file-type-associati ons-in-windows-7/

Microblocks. Build with logic.

palcal

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Joined: 12/10/2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 1982

Posted: 10:43pm 08 Dec 2012

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Tried that TZ but no go. Everything works OK but as soon as I check the files read only it won't work. And when I switch ioff I will lose them.
.

"It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all"

vasi

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Joined: 23/03/2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 1697

Posted: 12:25pm 11 Dec 2012

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Never had that problem in both Windows Vista and Wine under Linux! I don't have Windows 7. You are running the beta version?
Anyway, the authors of the software are nice guys and they listen to the users. They can solve your problem if their software is guilty.

Hobbit name: Togo Toadfoot of Frogmorton
Elvish name: Mablung Miriel
Beyound Arduino Lang

elproducts

Senior Member

Joined: 19/06/2011
Location: United States
Posts: 282

Posted: 03:34am 23 Dec 2012

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muddy0409 said http://www.futurlec.com.au/index.jsp

Can make boards with Express.
Very cheap compared to having them done by express themselves.
Delivery is also pretty good.
They are done in Thailand.

When you send the ExpressPCB files to Futurlec do you have to buy the gerber files from ExpressPCB and send those or can you just supply your ExpressPCB layout file and they take it from there?

www.elproducts.com

elproducts

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Joined: 19/06/2011
Location: United States
Posts: 282

Posted: 03:07am 28 Dec 2012

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elproducts said
When you send the ExpressPCB files to Futurlec do you have to buy the gerber files from ExpressPCB and send those or can you just supply your ExpressPCB layout file and they take it from there?

I'll answer my own question for the group since I got an answer from Futurlec.com.
They will accept the Expresspcb .pcb file directly, no need for gerber files.
This is a great second source to ExpressPCB.

It gets better.
Futurlec also offers different color solder mask. You can get blue, black or red for a 20% added cost over the standard green.

They also offer a thin board 0.8 mm vs the standard 1.6 mm board thickness. This is also a 20 % adder.

These are both features I wish I could get with ExpressPCB.

And wait, there is one more thing. I've run cost models for Futurlec vs ExpressPCB and it's clearly cheaper to have Futurlec produce the boards if you need 100 or less. Beyond that ExpressPCB gets cheaper.

I've found that the ExpressPCB $59 special for 3 - 2.5" x 3.8" boards(no solder mask or silkscreen, shipping included) is actually a better deal at futurlec.
Ship to USA $47, outside USA $48. A little slower shipping but that's a big savings.
In fact for $59 you can get 5 boards instead of 3 so you get 2 extra boards at Futurlec for the same price.

Now I haven't tried the service yet so this is all academic for me but this was a great tip from member Muddy0409.

www.elproducts.com

muddy0409

Senior Member

Joined: 15/06/2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 125

Posted: 07:17am 28 Dec 2012

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I have been using Futurlec for about 8 years. I have during that time tried the odd other supplier, generally for speed of getting the job done. Always more expensive, but sometimes just had to have the boards quick. Futurlec certainly aren't the quickest but if speed isn't important they will continue getting my work.
I generally only get boards dome in lots of 3 or 4 units and have always been very pleased with the end product. It has only been in the last 12 months that I found they can use Express. All my previous work has been with Protel Advanced PCB but am now very happy with Ezpress, especially since it runs on my laptop rather than having to use the old clunker PC out in the hot back shed.
I must read the Express licence one day to see if there is any caveat on using their free program to get boards done elsewhere.

Don't poo poo conspiracy theories.
Remember that everything ever discovered started somewhere as a theory.

isochronic
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Joined: 21/01/2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 689

Posted: 06:41pm 04 Feb 2013

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Just a warning..

I tried to install the recent version of eagle from the Cadsoft
site. (6.4.0 I think.) The install stops as my anti-viral stuff blocks it and reports
PnPworm - like activity. The license conditions specify that you connect to the internet when using it... I guess "phone home"-ware is not necessarily bad
but I can't see any real reason for it. I'm not sure if it is intended or just part of the usual 'net wildlife.
As far as I know Eagle was bought by Cadsoft which in turn is now owned by Farnell (UK owned).

Juri74

Senior Member

Joined: 06/02/2012
Location: Italy
Posts: 162

Posted: 09:25am 06 Feb 2013

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I use DesignSpark PCB
http://www.designspark.com/page/designspark-pcb-home-page
it is free, easy to use and it have gerber export option so i can choose who will manufacture my board

Edited by Juri74 2013-02-07

Grogster

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Joined: 31/12/2012
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 9589

Posted: 12:38pm 06 Feb 2013

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Just adding my 2c....

I prefer and use Sprint Layout for all my PCB work, as I find it really easy to use and it works well - FOR ME.

http://www.abacom-online.de/uk/html/produkte.html

PCB design software seems to be something of a bees nest when you mention names.
People have their favourites, and state why, and also state why they don't like or use member X's preferred software. It's a bit of a catch 22 really - mention an software name, and you will get lots of pros and cons, making it just as hard to choose one!!!

So, rather then say specifically WHY I use Sprint Layout, I will just say that I do because I like it.

Choosing a PCB program can be somewhat like settling on your favourite beer(substitute beer for whatever your favourite drink is) - you have to try several, to find the ones you like and the ones you don't, then you find the one you like best out of the ones you liked in the first place.

There is much to be said of the free options so certainly check them all out.
Sprint Layout is NOT free, but I do think it is worth the cash.
MHO only, naturally.

They also do schematic software and front panel design software, and I use these too.

Edited by Grogster 2013-02-07

Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!

BobD

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Joined: 07/12/2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 935

Posted: 07:24pm 06 May 2013

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In a recent communication from RS Components there was a note saying that Design Spark had released a new version (V5) of its PCB design software. It's free for non-commercial use but you have to register to activate the software. Get it here http://www.designspark.com/page/designspark-pcb-home-page

OA47

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Joined: 11/04/2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 982

Posted: 12:30pm 05 Oct 2013

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As I have been using the DOS version of Protel schematic and PCB software for more years than I care to mention, I thought I would have a look at one of these new products. I have been struggling with Designspark V5 and with persistence might get the hang of it as I can see the benefit of the large component libraries and flexibility using newer operating systems and peripherals. Would any of the learned users know if there is a way of importing the old Protel files into a program like Designspark?

Greg Fordyce
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Joined: 16/09/2011
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 153

Posted: 12:46pm 13 Oct 2013

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I've been trying out Upverter

Free to use if your designs are open source, or you can pay for private designs.

Nixie
Regular Member

Joined: 19/02/2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 66

Posted: 10:56am 15 Oct 2013

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This is probably pushing the boundaries of legalities..... But I'm asking anyway

I'm contemplating going down the PCB CNC pathway; and, I wonder if there is a software package available to be able to scan a PCB layout, or existing board, into a gerber file (or other appropriate format) for direct import into a CNC machine's software?

Thanks in advance, Nic.
VK3COW

JohnS
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Joined: 18/11/2011
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 4036

Posted: 01:17pm 15 Oct 2013

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Should be legal if it's not copyright etc.

In many jurisdictions, copyright is automatic i.e. in creating the item the copyright is also created and owned by the creator (or his employer, if relevant).

OSHW would allow it, I think - but I'm not sure. Do check :)

John

vasi

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Joined: 23/03/2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 1697

Posted: 01:21pm 15 Oct 2013

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There are PCB programs and utilities able to scan a black&white bitmap of a pcb side and generating CNC code. gEDA PCB can do that (on his own files), and I think also pcb2gcode

Speaking from memory... not checked yet but you have a start. Do a search also on RepRap.org site for further info.
______
Edit: Complete informations about pcb2gcode on reprap.org

Edited by vasi 2013-10-16

Hobbit name: Togo Toadfoot of Frogmorton
Elvish name: Mablung Miriel
Beyound Arduino Lang

MicroBlocks

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Joined: 12/05/2012
Location: Thailand
Posts: 2209

Posted: 04:47pm 15 Oct 2013

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Using CNC for making PCB's has it own sets of problems.
One of those is that you need to prevent the board from warping as the copper layer is really thin and you want the cutter/engraving tool to dig into the material evenly.
If not the some traces will be thick and some can even disappear.
Double sided tape works but i found it a big nuisance to remove it.
Another is height probing or a spring loaded end mill. Results were in my case just acceptable.

I found the laser printer and etching method much better and faster.
Now i don't even bother anymore with both methods.
The CNC method because it is slow and needs too much time preparing, the chemical method because , well it is chemical.
I use breadboard or strip/vero board for small simple one offs and use a pcb manufacturer for everything else.
It helps of course that futurelec is 'around the corner'.
Futurelec is not the best in price though, especially when you need more then a few.

Edited by TZAdvantage 2013-10-17

Microblocks. Build with logic.

Ray B
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Joined: 16/02/2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 219

Posted: 05:39pm 15 Oct 2013

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Stripboard /Veroboard - What is the current best editor???? Preferably freeware or reasonable price: Not been discussed for a while.
LOCHMASTER http://www.abacom-online.de/uk/html/lochmaster.html
VEECAD http://veecad.com/
Others ???

Regards

RayB from Perth WA

Grogster

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Joined: 31/12/2012
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 9589

Posted: 05:40pm 15 Oct 2013

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There is PEBBLE, but it is designed more for drawing prototype layouts....

PEBBLE

EDIT: Link goes to a download page, instead of a forum thread. Edited by Grogster 2013-10-17

Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!

Ray B
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Joined: 16/02/2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 219

Posted: 12:08am 16 Oct 2013

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Fritzing is an additional option for Veroboard which kind of suggests autorouting & option to convert to PCB but I've never tried to that extent.
fritzing.org

RayB from Perth WA

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