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Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261
Posted: 12:58pm 20 Oct 2017
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Hi Paul
I responded to your challenge, and read it right through! My reaction is GULP! What has happened since the end of your account? BTW, because of numerous stories like yours (though not in such meticulous detail!) and because I use vb6, I have stayed with a very stable Windows 7 64 bit. However, I do suspect you had a virus of some kind... And I have yet to be convinced that virus scanners are either 100% effective or <tinfoil hat mode on> do not themselves meddle with settings to ensure they are justified.Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner...
Paul_L Guru Joined: 03/03/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 769
Posted: 03:29pm 20 Oct 2017
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Herry,
I'm pretty sure there was no virus involved. McAfee, Malwarebytes and the various microsoft scanners can't find anything. Microsoft did something during April to mess up one or more of the device drivers. The microsoft techs agree with that. Gateway went backrupt, Asus took over their support, but they don't support the older win 7 boxes with device drivers. The microsoft techs wanted to install a clean win 7 but that would have destroyed the program installations so I'm just keeping the machine off the internet.
When I get the replacement win 10 box up to speed I will try the Raxco Perfect Updater program out. They say it will find the correct drivers if they exist. If that doesn't work I'll flatten the thing and install a linux distro.
Paul in NY
Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9610
Posted: 09:02pm 20 Oct 2017
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Dear God.......
You are right - my problems pale in comparison to that. Crikey. Faced with that, I think I would have turned to the Whisky for comfort....
Perhaps this is the problem you run into with COMPULSORY updates - some updates are bound and seem to definitely be corrupting drivers and other system stuff.
NOT good. Linux is calling me.....(I am trying to install Mint on a spare machine this weekend)Edited by Grogster 2017-10-22Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261
Posted: 01:15am 21 Oct 2017
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I did, and it nearly killed me. Now I stick to red wine! You will find Mint fine!Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner...
Paul_L Guru Joined: 03/03/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 769
Posted: 01:15pm 21 Oct 2017
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I gave up drinking about 40 years ago when diabetes attacked me. Polacks specialize in Vodka, not beer, whisky or wine. Vodka and diabetes don't mix.
I can't abandon windoze. For the last 26 years since Pan Am shut down I have been writing really nice database programs using Clipper and then VisualFoxPro9 for dozens of public charities. VFP9 still runs on W10. It uses a specialized implementation of SQL (pronounced squeel by mainframers) and there is nothing as flexible available under linux. My programs are out there in over 200 Elks, Lions, VFW, KofC, YMCA, YWCA, and YMHA installations and I don't want to abandon them! I'M STUCK!!!!
You guys have probably been wondering whether I've given up developing my geothermal control program. I haven't! I've just been wrestling with this damned windoze thing.
First they broke their own System Restore when they changed their protection of the %Program Files%\WindowsApps\ directory. (See error 0X80070091 and KB3213986.) Then they began messing with advanced driver features which caused windoze updates to crash older machines with older, abandoned, drivers.
I have sent out letters to all of the charities I have worked for suggesting that they get together and sue microsoft when windoze will no longer run their VFP9 programs! I have gotten about 45 interested responses so far. This might prove to be interesting.
Aaaah well, back to the geothermal code!!!
Paul in NY
Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9610
Posted: 01:25pm 21 Oct 2017
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I am extremely unlikely to abandon Windoze, but I am willing to have a play around with Mint as I am much more familiar with Linux then I ever have been before, and I am learning more and more about Linux the more I use it.
I guess it has to be said that every version of Windoze has it's lovers and it's haters. I remember a handful of people even singing the praises of Windows ME a few years ago, and I could not stand that one either. :(
I think the problem start to fester, if you are the kind of user who wants to change things about your system. If you are prepared to leave all the default settings alone, and let Microsoft decide for you on what is best for your system, you may well have less problems, but as soon as you start changing the settings around to the way YOU want them.....
Might be wrong on that, but that is the feeling I get.Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
joebog1 Senior Member Joined: 07/11/2015 Location: AustraliaPosts: 114
Posted: 03:39pm 21 Oct 2017
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Let us all hope you continue with Linux, Grogster Once the phobia is past you will rapidly dump windowz.
Dont forget that it will run on a machine with 512k RAM and a i386. In limited form. Its super easy on hard drives, ( they dont run ALL the time) Is extremely frugal on resources, VERY economical on power requirements ( read: VERY suitable for off grid )
AND!!! Mint was just a suggestion, its easy to learn, is ( sort of intuitive ) hard to bugger up, ( you will need to use a terminal after a crash) But I have NEVER lost a file!!! AND there are literally hundreds of flavours available.
There was a major world Unix crash about 1984, that took out almost ALL computers ( as opposed to games machines) like those at CSIRO, NASA, and the US military. It took two days for almost every machine to be up and running. The virus was less than 100 lines of code!!. I only know about that crash as I worked for both companies at about that time. ( CSIRO/NASA )
I have not heard ( or experienced ) another even remotely similar.
Joe
Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9610
Posted: 04:20pm 21 Oct 2017
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Interesting. What did it attack? The MBR?Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
isochronic Guru Joined: 21/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 689
Posted: 06:41pm 21 Oct 2017
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Given a choice between a free OS like Mint that does not require so much bloat, and even a free W10 that does, most people who are on limited data bandwidth have no real option. Few people either can or want to, put up with a system that will spontaneously chop net access while it downloads gigabytes of update - meaning unreliable - and creates unplanned expense as it does so. That might sound luddite but that would be most people in the third world. It is also the parts of country areas, and metropolitan Sydney, where the 'Nationals Botched Network' is not real or anything like the pollies hype.. At this point the data cost of W10 updates is going to cost more than the cost of old machines that will be running it. A seriously Dumb strategy if you ask me - unless updates are made a lot more accessable Microsoft has just made it virtually necessary (ed-for a lot of people) to dump its main product.
I tried Mint a few years ago, it was pretty good and a lot faster on equivalent hardware.. There was a problem with a bad distro ( a year ago ?) that had been hacked but I think that has been cleared now.
(edit) Ironic isn't it ? Updates are mandatory for security we were told. Now the update is for 3D/VR use apparently. Edited by chronic 2017-10-23
Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9610
Posted: 08:30pm 21 Oct 2017
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chronic - I have to agree with your post there. The CONSTANT updates to W10(even on a clean install) are enough to drive me NUTS, and I would never use it on any of my machines. I guess I need to come-clean and admit that it IS on my 10" tablet, but I hate it with an intensity such that hardly ever use it. I guess I could look at the possibility of using Win8 or something on it - it dual-boots W10 and Android, so one would think that loading a new OS would be possible...(but many new cheaper tablets are locked and you can't!)Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261
Posted: 08:44pm 21 Oct 2017
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I've had diabetes type II for year and years, (started with heavy boozy lunches and heavy me). The scotch caused AFL so I stopped that. I find that red wine actually reduces BSL!Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner...
Boppa Guru Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814
Posted: 10:36am 22 Oct 2017
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I'm in Brisbakers, and went from cable- blitzed along, had paytv/fetch through it no issues, was forced off that onto NBN (No Bloody Network) and have gone back to free to air tv and renting dvd (well I discovered they are usb sticks these days- and you have to bring your own!)
Fetch/ paytv through NBN is totally unusable here, watch 30 sec, buffer 5 sec, watch 30 sec, buffer 5 sec... Worse the fetch box doesnt appear to record the data itself (which would at least make movies etc watchable after downloading/saving- which was my first idea)- no they appear to record the video output of the tuners- so the recordings are of the watch 30 sec, buffer 5 sec type too
AARRGGGHHHH!!!!!!!!!
Utube hd is unusable, utube sd is barely usable- I pause at the beginning and wait until at least 1/2 is downloaded before starting watching- otherwise I catch up to it and back to buffering
I got a 'unlimited' download limit on the house- which is pointless as it isnt worth downloading anything on it- if I want to watch fetchtv/stan/netflix I have to use the phones data- and that costs too much
Seriously- for a 3rd world country it would be pathetic, for a supposedly 1st world country and AFTER a multibillion dollar upgrade????
Pathetic doesnt cover it....
Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261
Posted: 10:56am 22 Oct 2017
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I'm on NBN FTTN 25/5 and finding it excellent at all times of the day and night, and on YouTube too... I wonder if that might be because I am politically neutral...Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner...
palcal Guru Joined: 12/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1993
Posted: 10:59am 22 Oct 2017
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Well, Win 10 I would rather not talk about. I have had to do a reinstall on the laptop I have twice. Tried Ubuntu on the box in the workshop that runs XP, a few times but could not really get into it. Downloaded a Mint ISO but it wouldn't load, so I have now ordered a Mint CD. As for the NBN what a joke, we got fibre to the node and it made no difference. I do a speed check and it tells me I am getting 25Mbs download and 4Mbs upload but in reality when I download a large file I get more like 1 Mbs. Paul.
Edit.... I think it probably depends where you live and how far you are from the Node. I am 60Km north of Townsville and about 500 metres from the Node.Edited by palcal 2017-10-23"It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all"
joebog1 Senior Member Joined: 07/11/2015 Location: AustraliaPosts: 114
Posted: 12:23pm 22 Oct 2017
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Soo!!! Weekend is over. How did the Mint install go Grogster?
So Palcal is something similar to me as far as NBN goes. Im 20 kliks west of Mareeba, I pay $79.95 a month but NOT $80, that makes it cheap. Im on satellite I pay for 25/5. IF I stay up till 3AM I can just about get 250k down and perhaps 50k up. During the day its more like 100k down and 20k up.
My Linux updates ( I still run bleeding edge latest releases )take about 3 or 4 minutes everytime I start up, and there is something to update . IF there is a major upgrade ( like a new release ) it takes about 6 hours, BUT new releases only happen every couple of years. I advised Grogster to use LTS ( Long Term Support ) version of whatever he wants to play with, so he should be OK for major updates for quite a while. The next major release is due 18.04 It will have a new name and be available after April 2018. Hence the title, 18.04. Just to show you how "soft" it is on hardware here is my system.
If you need help Grogster, just ask
Joe
Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261
Posted: 12:47pm 22 Oct 2017
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For the last lap of copper (between you and your node) VDSL is used. That protocol is much more fussy about line quality and distance than is ADSL, and 500 m is getting a bit long. As I said, I am very happy but I am about 50 m from my node. Where the NBN has fallen down is the quality of the work of some of its subbies, because those of them that care a jot are under pressure to connect a large quantity of homes. There were similar problems with subbies during the short time FTTP was being sold. So it seems to be about selection, training and supervision. I don't believe that party politics has anything to do with it. The elected govt made a choice to use the cheaper technology because it felt that the old system was far too expensive, which it was. The anti-coalition people have hijacked the debate and made it political. Supporters of all parties habitually do this. As I said, I am neutral, and interested in the technology. I don't support any of them although there are individuals I admire. Yes, FTTP would have been preferable if it could have been afforded and if there was radical overhaul of NBNCo's practices as they were then. The other factor is the bandwidth bought by RSPs, which seems in some cases to be inadequate for peak periods, now that uses that were completely inappropriate for an end to end network are now rife, especially pseudo-broadcast.Edited by Herry 2017-10-23Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner...
Alastair Senior Member Joined: 03/04/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 161
Posted: 01:39pm 22 Oct 2017
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We built a new house south of Sydney in 2016 and moved in during November. Prior to the house being completed I signed up for a package deal - landline, mobile, nbn and Foxtel with Telstra. The Foxtel satellite dish was installed and commissioned within 2 weeks. Telstra/NBN would not connect the house until we were in residence, multiple excuses/reasons.
Once I advised them we were in residence they then said the first appointment for a technician to come and connect was 6 weeks. I complained. 6 weeks was the answer. Why I asked, the house is wired, the wire from the new node about 800m away is in place - I had watched them laying the cable and putting the box in on our daily dog walks. 6 weeks repeated.
On the agreed day a 7am phone call to say he would be late. Eventually arrived the next morning full of apologies. Nice chap and after giving him a cup of coffee and chatting he admitted that he was a subbie, too many connections being put on his list each day. He tested the performance of the copper to the house and said that even though the short run to the house was new, the cable back to the node was old copper and bad. He offered to connect us but recommended that he report the cable faulty and have it replaced as we would not get good performance and have faults. He knew the area and apparently the phone lines were all installed about 30+ years ago.
He explained that even though he is fully qualified he cannot touch the street cable without approval from NBN who now control it. They won't do it by phone it has to be done with forms.
4 weeks later another chap turned up without warning and ran a new cable back to the node in very short time. No he can't connect it to the house as that is not his job. He will advise his boss that the work is complete and ready for connection. 2 weeks later the original 'specialist' returned up and in 15 minutes we had nbn and phone. He tested the line and reckoned we could get ~50 download but that was the VDSL limit of the wire back to the node.
Since connection our service has been fault free (fingers crossed). I signed up for 25/5 which I have verified numerous times. I do see a slight slow down if I am using it around school come home time when all the kids get on line, but never serious.
So my judgement is that administration and demarcation and the limited availability of quality subbies is the problem. I was lucky to get a good local. Other folk in the same street who are connected by old copper are having problems. This will get worse as old copper does not like being disturbed.
Edited by Alastair 2017-10-23Cheers, Alastair
Boppa Guru Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814
Posted: 02:30pm 22 Oct 2017
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Once I move to my new rural property, I'm going to be up the proverbial creek, its sat (which the locals that have it arent impressed by, both the service quality and the price), dialup or 3g/4g 3g is just too expensive to really use as a full time internet connection ($10/gig through telstra, the only provider in the area) dialup is too slow, and sat too expensive and unreliable
My new house is going to be literally right in the middle of the block, which means technically I would need two nodes on my property to reach the street! The neighbours have adsl at the moment, but have been told its going and they will have to get sat to continue to get broadband, so they are less than impressed, after a multibillion dollar 'upgrade' they are going from $70/unlimited gig a month with at least fairly fast speeds and near enough 100% uptime to $90/70g a month with sometimes days on end outages in bad weather,or data bills in the hundreds to use the cell network- they are in the same boat in that currently they stream tv with few issues, on the new sat connection or 3g/4g that will be a thing of the past
I actually looked into the sat system many islanders use in the Pacific, its expensive to set up (several thousand) and altho it will technically work in Qld, it's not 'supposed' to be used in Oz for political reasons, and you have to have a valid address (ie a po box on an island somewhere) in order to get it, data is much cheaper than nbn sat data plans (altho still expensive, they have $50us 200gig plans or $100us/unlimited) but give speeds about halfway between nbn sat and actual cable to the house speeds
I'm wondering whats going to happen to the dialup people when the nbn finishes its rollout- are they going to be cut off too? as many are in the boat I will be- dialup is cheap but slow, cells expensive but fast
Herry Senior Member Joined: 31/05/2014 Location: AustraliaPosts: 261
Posted: 02:43pm 22 Oct 2017
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My son has a farm in an isolated location in Southern NSW (mainland), with no phone infrastructure. Consequently he had satellite fitted no problem. Of course there is delay in initial contact (ping is large) because of the distance to and from the bird, but actual data speeds are not too bad. He frequently sends me high grade photos.. .
Are you sure you mean dial-up (not ADSL)!? Didn't know there were any such connections left. Senior?! Whatever it says, I'm a complete and utter beginner...
Boppa Guru Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814
Posted: 03:02pm 22 Oct 2017
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That first quote isnt the nbn system, its in the first sentence! The nbn is putting more people onto the existing system (sunbird?snowbird? some bird) which does have fast speeds yes, but small data allowances for many $- certainly not a direct replacement for an existing adsl system
And yes I meant dialup... 56k, 1980 tech...as many rural properties cant even get adsl at all, and nbn is disabling many existing adsl customers for some reason (something to do with the exchange I was told 2ndhand)
This is in a town that until jan of this year didnt even have 3g- they still had a 2g celltower (singular)- they now have a 3g tower (singular) that works about 5km out of town, then its back to good old uhf cbs.... (they got 2 official and two 'unofficial' repeaters)
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Notice. New forum software under development. It's going to miss a few functions and look a bit ugly for a while, but I'm working on it full time now as the old forum was too unstable. Couple days, all good. If you notice any issues, please contact me.
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