Can we not have the Pi-Zero debate (again) in this thread.

Best wishes,

Tom

  Quote  

why not just port the whole MMBasic interpreter to run on the the RPi A+/Zero using something like ultibo:
https://ultibo.org/

Since you are the only one who programs in Pascal I assume you are volunteering. After all "its not rocket science"

Considering the fact that we'd like to see greater exposure for MMB in general and that lots of users are interested in games, etc., wasn't there once mention of the MMB4L being able to run on Android?

There would be some exposure, at least, on Google Play and Android is a great platform for games.

Just a thought.

  PhenixRising said  

Considering the fact that we'd like to see greater exposure for MMB in general and that lots of users are interested in games, etc., wasn't there once mention of the MMB4L being able to run on Android?

Early in the development cycle of MMB4L I was able to compile and run it under Termux on Android, but then the Termux people did an update and since then even when compiled on the updated version it crashes mysteriously before it even enters the main() function; frankly it crashes before it does anything very much at all. Because it wasn't important to me I set it aside.

Even if that were resolved MMB4L has neither sound nor hi-res graphics support, basically I have got it to the level which I required to run Z-MIM, SAAINT, my pre-processor (sptrans) and my comms program (gonzo) and since then I've only been conducting occasional maintenance. I hope to get back to it one day.

Best wishes,

Tom
Edited 2023-12-06 02:11 by thwill

  matherp said  

The CMM2 supports normal USB keyboards NOT PS2. The restriction is that the ST USB stack does not support composite USB devices which is any keyboard with a built in mouse, a dual mode dongle, or an in-built hub (e.g.  Raspberry Pi keyboard)

Thanks for clarifying that Peter. I know I had to try a couple of keyboards before I got one that worked. It wasn't a huge deal for me - as with most hobbyists I had a bunch lying around. But this comes back to one of the reasons for providing a complete bundle, if we ship it with a keyboard that we know works on the CMM2 without any hardware changes - then that's one less hurdle/problem for future adopters to struggle with.

  thwill said  

But seriously if the rest of us (mostly excluding me) can't get a maintained software archive and a decent wiki up and running then having Peter and the rest of the band update the hardware and firmware is a waste of their time.

It was never my intention to suggest that we need any hardware or firmware changes - I appreciate the crazy amount of hours Peter and Geoff have already dedicated to this system, and it would be unfair to impose on them further. Having said that, it is my strong belief that what we have in place already is far more mature than any of the other new-retro systems coming out. From the firmware, to the instruction manuals, to the welcome tape. That is a fully functioning bundle.

Yes, if there is any incredible firmware change that can be implemented, then yes, let's discuss it (and hopefully get someone to volunteer to investigate) - but right now today - the system is in a fantastically ready state.

Having said all of that, I remember there was talk of using an ESP32 WiFi chip with it. Was that ever officially integrated?

I'm happy to take a stab at getting the online archive up and running - and a solution where people can connect to their home network and browse/download games directly from the archive to their CMM2 would be useful. Note: I'm not talking HTML - this would be more of a BBS than a web browser. I'd be happy to look into developing that in line with the archive.

Doesn't the CMM2 V2 have a socket for a ESP8266-01S? I don't think there was any support for it though. THerer's no socket in the V1.

  Quote  

Doesn't the CMM2 V2 have a socket for a ESP8266-01S? I don't think there was any support for it though.

Yes, and of course there is support - its called MMBasic

  PeteCotton said  

It was never my intention to suggest that we need any hardware or firmware changes...

I wasn't intending to suggest "you" were, but the thread was drifting off to the "future of MMBasic" rather than being about giving the CMM2 another shot of juice.

  PeteCotton said  

I'm happy to take a stab at getting the online archive up and running - and a solution where people can connect to their home network and browse/download games directly from the archive to their CMM2 would be useful. Note: I'm not talking HTML - this would be more of a BBS than a web browser. I'd be happy to look into developing that in line with the archive.

... and I'm going to desperately try and not involve myself, but if I were doing it then I would be looking at writing something that whilst as user-friendly as CMM2.fun was really acting as a wrapper around a repository on github (+ automatically maintaining a local clone in-case M$/github get frisky).

Good luck,

Tom
Edited 2023-12-06 03:00 by thwill

VGA is not going anywhere. I checked the local superstore ads and nearly all computer monitors have an HDMI and a VGA port and some of the higher priced monitors add a DP port. Even the most inexpensive ($70) 21.5 inch monitor has a HDMI and a VGA port.

  Mixtel90 said  

Doesn't the CMM2 V2 have a socket for a ESP8266-01S? I don't think there was any support for it though. THerer's no socket in the V1.

  matherp said  

Yes, and of course there is support - its called MMBasic

Thanks guys. I've been doing some digging and I found this (well, when I say doing some digging, I actually mean I read the manual - which I should have done first - sorry).

ESP-01 Module
There is a footprint on the PCB for connecting an ESP-01 WiFi module to COM2. Version 5.07.00 and later of
the firmware allows COM2 to be used as a serial console so if the correct USB/UART code is loaded into the
ESP-01 it will be possible to access the console of the CMM2 remotely.
At this time MMBasic does not include any Internet functions using this device in but communications can be
established using the normal serial communications protocol included in MMBasic.

This is perfect - that's all I'd need.

  thwill said  

....the thread was drifting off to the "future of MMBasic" rather than being about giving the CMM2 another shot of juice.

Yes, once again I think this enthusiasm is a testament to the passion people have for MMBasic and all of the machines that implement it. I don't know about you guys, but I get genuinely excited discussing the possibilities here.

I did find the thread about Gen 2 (linked below if anyone wants to read it again), and that is a crazy powerful retro computer.
https://www.thebackshed.com/forum/ViewTopic.php?TID=13940&P=1

If there was a North American supplier, I'd be tempted to buy one - just to have it....

Grogster - Are you willing to ship to Canada? Are you thinking of making another batch?

  PeteCotton said  

more of a BBS than a web browser. I'd be happy to look into developing that in line with the archive.

I believe user frnno967 developed a CMM2 BBS and posted code on github: CMM2 BBS?

I didn't look into it, so don't know what the features are, or whether it is still available.

  lizby said  

  PeteCotton said  

more of a BBS than a web browser. I'd be happy to look into developing that in line with the archive.

I believe user frnno967 developed a CMM2 BBS and posted code on github: CMM2 BBS?

I didn't look into it, so don't know what the features are, or whether it is still available.

Thanks! I'll check it out.

  PeteCotton said  

Grogster - Are you willing to ship to Canada? Are you thinking of making another batch?

Yes, I ship anywhere in the world, really.
I took an order from Canada just the other day.

L'ile D'Entree, if that means anything to you.

Yes, as far as batches are concerned, I will keep having them made, as long as there are orders for them.  When the orders stop, I naturally, won't order any more from JLC till the few that are on the shelf, sell.  This works for me financially, and is easy to manage along with my other work, and still means people can order units if they want them.

Check your PM's, Pete, cos I sent you a wee message about this stuff.....

  Grogster said  

Check your PM's, Pete, cos I sent you a wee message about this stuff.....

Thanks - response sent!

  al18 said  

VGA is not going anywhere. I checked the local superstore ads and nearly all computer monitors have an HDMI and a VGA port and some of the higher priced monitors add a DP port. Even the most inexpensive ($70) 21.5 inch monitor has a HDMI and a VGA port.

Sorry for taking so long to respond, but I've been pondering this point for the last couple of days. I think if we can cheaply include an HDMI adapter in the full package we should. Probably every single person in this forum has a glut of VGA cables that they're keeping "just in case", however, for non-techy people they are not common items (or maybe they have one "somewhere"). If we're going for the plug and play aspect, then it has to be as familiar as any other modern piece of electronics. I'm thinking of one of my neighbors as a typical demographic for the full package. He grew up playing with the Commodore 64, tried programming it, eventually gave up and now has lots of spare cash, but just reminisces about the good old days. He's a smart guy, but he's never dabbled in electronics. I guarantee that he would get this machine home - then call promptly me up and ask if I had such a thing as a "VGA cable" lying around.....

Now, we'd still be producing the much cheaper bare bones kit for techy people who know what amperage their USB power supply is, and what keyboards are compatible etc. But if we are to truly reduce the barrier to entry for this system, then something as simple as an HDMI adapter might make all of the world of difference.

While I agree that HDMI would be a great plus for the CMM2, and have exactly the same adapter that you pictured, having it sticking out of the back and having to provide an additional USB power supply is not ideal. If HDMI could be incorporated within the case that would be my ideal. A wall wart with two USB outputs or a Y cable would neaten it up a bit but... I just find the VGA cable easier.

One thing that has been missing from ALL of the Maximites (in my opinion) is an Atari style joystick port. Since the first mono one there have been debates over which pins to use for a joystick and with so many conflicting viewpoints nothing was ever resolved.

I have PS Labs Deluxe version of the CMM2 and, along with the Hobbytronics USB mouse chip, it has a joystick socket on the front. Both were selling points for me. With the use of a small-home made "gender changer" type device I can also use the famicom type controller.



The joystick port uses the dreaded pin 40 which caused a kerfuffle early in the piece but has caused no strife for anyone as far as I know.

It's great to see the CMM2 is available again. LeoNicolas is writing a new game for it and I hope someday that some of the stuff being produced for the PicoMite will be ported to the CMM2.  

Bill

Interesting idea on the HDMI converter as a standard option, on a more "Advanced" kit.  That could certainly be done, and listed as an "Optional extra" for example.

I like the idea of having an HDMI converter inside the unit, but to do that, would require a totally new case, front panels, and PCB layout in general.

Not that any of that is REALLY a killer, but is it worth it?

An external stand-alone VGA-to-HDMI converter would seem to be the best choice, as then it can simply be an optional extra, without changing anything on the original design in terms of layout and/or front-and-rear case panels.

I see ANY kind of HDMI converter, as ONLY a converter to the HDMI format.
You would NEVER see any kind of increase in resolution over what the CMM2 already does on VGA, which is why I think some are put off the idea - it is, to some extent, a waste of effort, as you really aren't GAINING anything - it's just a change of video output protocol.

I also prefer the Atari/C-64 style of joystick socket using the 9-pin "D" connector.
But I think that the Nunchuk controller was chosen for it's availability and cheapness.  The old digital Atari style joysticks are relatively hard to find these days.

IF - and this is a big 'IF' - we were to do a new PCB layout that included an internal VGA-to-HDMI converter module(that would run in parallel with the standard VGA output), case and layout, that would be a good time to put "D" sockets on for the joysticks, and also include Rob's USB support chip too.  As that chip outputs in a standard serial protocol, you probably would not even need to change the CMM2 firmware - you just intercept the output from the USB chip, and do whatever for the mouse and keyboard via interrupts in MMBASIC.  It may not be that simple in reality, but it would have to be, as I don't think we'd ever convince Peter(matherp) to change the code to support it.

Hi Grogster,
Please forgive me if I'm wrong but doesn't the CMM2 Gen 2 already have a spot for the Hobbytronics mouse controller chip. I don't think it would be viable to get JLC to fit it but I think it IS something you could supply and fit as an optional extra. The connector is fitted on the rear below the keyboard socket.



The Nunchuk is not very good in use, the movement is too imprecise, the Classic is much better. I've been through the exercise of testing each type for Tom's Laser Cycle for the CMM2.


Bill