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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : DUMB DISPLAY

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PeterB
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Joined: 05/02/2015
Location: Australia
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Posted: 07:06am 12 Sep 2019
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G'Day All.

There are many displays available that come in a range of sizes and are usually in some sort of protective housing. Things like truck rear vision systems up to monster TVs. The thing they have in common is an A/V input. So, is it possible to put something between an E64 and one of these devices to make a dumb display?
The SSD1963 chip is available so that gets the data neatly arranged in a buffer but then what? Is there a device to solve that?
Or, could it be done with this Ccode stuff?

Peter
 
retepsnikrep

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Joined: 31/12/2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 131
Posted: 08:54pm 12 Sep 2019
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Tellymate.. Serial to video chip/code. Very useful

http://www.batsocks.co.uk/products/Other/TellyMate.htm
Gen1 Honda Insights.
 
PeterB
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Location: Australia
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Posted: 11:35pm 12 Sep 2019
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G'Day retep  

I particularly want to interface with mite because of MMBASIC with its abilities.
A VGA to composite converter is on my list of things to look into but I have to remember all these video standards etc.
I am surprised that such a thing does not exist given the popularity of the mites.
Thanks for your interest.

Peter  
 
bigmik

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Joined: 20/06/2011
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Posted: 01:51am 13 Sep 2019
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GDay Peter,

VGA to composite do exist, I do not know how well they work let alone what a MMBasic format will look like. At least they are cheap enough.

Aliexpress link

Kind Regards,

Mick
Mick's uMite Stuff can be found >>> HERE (Kindly hosted by Dontronics) <<<
 
Boppa
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Joined: 08/11/2016
Location: Australia
Posts: 814
Posted: 02:04am 13 Sep 2019
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I have two of these connected to my and my sisters security camera systems, to allow the output to run through the lounge TV's at our houses

They work quite well, there is a slight quality reduction compared to the vga out directly, but I don't know how much of that is due to the converter, and how much is just that the composite video output isn't as good as a SVGA output in the first place

(We did it because the TV in my case only has composite video inputs, and in my sisters case, there was a 25m run from the security system to the TV, which wasn't doable with a vga cable- plus the composite video cable was a lot easier to pass through the several walls and a floor than the bulkier VGA  plug...)
 
PeterB
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Posted: 07:03am 13 Sep 2019
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G'Day both

If I get the data into an SSD1963 I should be able to clock it out, add some sync and DAC, into a AVG to composite converter and Bob's your uncle. The problem is, will I live that long? But I will continue to think about it.
HDMI is digital and I know nothing about the format but it would be tempting.
This may just one of those projects where, when they are chucking the dirt in, I will still be thinking "what if I.................."
Why has it not been done?

Peter
 
TassyJim

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Joined: 07/08/2011
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Posted: 08:09am 13 Sep 2019
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It would be simpler to use a colour maximite as the display driver.
UBW32 style or circiutgizmo's board are both reasonable sizes.
You would still need a RGB to composite adapter or stick with monochrome.

You can still put a E64 as the brains if needed.

Jim
Edited 2019-09-13 18:11 by TassyJim
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panky

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Joined: 02/10/2012
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Posts: 1094
Posted: 12:18pm 13 Sep 2019
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Even simpler would be one of Peter M's MM Extremes - either the 100 or 144 pin jobs that have vga out. Add an external vga to composite adapter off ebay for under $10 to finish the job. This would give you access to all the MM+ fancy gui graphics.

Or again, a Picromite with HDMI out may be an option.

IMHO, trying to do something with the ssd1963 would be extremely problematic. As I understand it, driving an LCD display is quite different to normal "tv" style composite video.

Panky
... almost all of the Maximites, the MicromMites, the MM Extremes, the ArmMites, the PicoMite and loving it!
 
lizby
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Joined: 17/05/2016
Location: United States
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Posted: 01:56pm 13 Sep 2019
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  panky said  Or again, a Picromite with HDMI out may be an option.


Indeed--if that's what you're looking for, why not Pi-cromite on a pi zero w with one of these HDMI to composite modules

Around $20 US all-in including shipping.
PicoMite, Armmite F4, SensorKits, MMBasic Hardware, Games, etc. on fruitoftheshed
 
PeterB
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Posted: 01:05am 14 Sep 2019
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Good morning / evening All

Thanks a lot. Information flooding in and now I have some reading to do. There are things there that I have never thought about. Another steep learning curve, will they never end?

Peter
 
BrianP
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Joined: 30/03/2017
Location: Australia
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Posted: 01:25am 14 Sep 2019
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The grey cells need constant exercise

B...
 
PeterB
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Posted: 01:44am 14 Sep 2019
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Good morning B

According to the ABS (I think) I've got just over 8 years left. At my present rate of learning, the "out" is much greater than the "in" but who cares?

The other thing is, when you exercise something, are bits supposed to break off?

Peter
 
TassyJim

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Posted: 02:51am 14 Sep 2019
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Electronics Australia March 81 had an on screen audio frequency graphic analyser

If I can find the circuit for it , there might be something that we can adapt.

Jim
VK7JH
MMedit   MMBasic Help
 
TassyJim

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Posted: 04:34am 14 Sep 2019
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I surprised myself.
My shed must be better organised than I thought.
I found the circuit diagram for the graphic analyser.

It uses the TEA1002 IC to convert from RGB to composite.
It would be ideal to hang of the back of a MMX or CMM to get the composite signal without too many other parts.

Her is a link to a signal generator that uses the same chip
http://messui.polygonal-moogle.com/comp/tea1002.pdf

Jim
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BrianP
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Posted: 10:34pm 14 Sep 2019
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  PeterB said  The other thing is, when you exercise something, are bits supposed to break off?

I'm reminded of the advice drummed into us at an early age that we should keep an open mind - but then I find things fall out...
B
 
Grogster

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Joined: 31/12/2012
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 9029
Posted: 04:28am 15 Sep 2019
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  PeterB said  G'Day retep  

I particularly want to interface with mite because of MMBASIC with its abilities.
A VGA to composite converter is on my list of things to look into but I have to remember all these video standards etc.
I am surprised that such a thing does not exist given the popularity of the mites.
Thanks for your interest.

Peter  


There is the ASCII Terminal that Geoff made for doing that kind of thing.  Can output single-colour VGA or composite video, and accepts standard serial from any MM or other controller such as PICAXE.

A word of warning on the VGA-to-composite adaptors:  Some of them DON'T like the taste of the resolution that the MM or CMM produces, and will simply refuse to convert it.  You may have to try a few different ones to get one that works.
Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
 
PeterB
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Posts: 639
Posted: 06:13am 15 Sep 2019
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G'Day Grogster

I have ordered a VGA to Comp. converter and I have a Colour MaxiMite. Nancye has a 7 in truck rear view display on her gopher so I'm well in.
There is so much stuff that is almost suitable that I'm starting to regret starting.
But some time ago you did have a need for back to back dumb displays so is this of interest to you?

Peter
 
robert.rozee
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Joined: 31/12/2012
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Posted: 12:01pm 15 Sep 2019
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as i recall, with a composite video signal the vertical resolution is limited to something like 576 lines for 50Hz PAL, or 480 lines for 60Hz NTSC. the horizontal resolution is more tricky to nail down, as luminance and chrominance components of the signal are encoded quite differently: 160–200 colour dots if you want the nicest possible image, 320–400 colour dots if you don't mind some artefacts, and if your signal is monochrome then something like 640 or even 720 dots on a good day.

for a small 5" screen displaying a PICTURE (ie, from a reversing camera), the above is just fine - the colour resolution of the human eye isn't that great anyway and you don't notice anything wrong. but once your screen size gets bigger and the relevance of fine detail increases (ie, displaying computer graphics or text) then the shortfalls become visible to the user.

i can see VGA support on screens becoming more and more uncommon over the next few years, with the vast majority of monitors only supporting HDMI and composite. after that, composite will start to fade away. which leaves the question: what will we plug our maximites into? will the only games in town become a micromite hooked up to a terminal or a RPi running mmbasic?


cheers,
rob   :-)
 
ceptimus
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Joined: 05/07/2019
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 130
Posted: 02:45pm 15 Sep 2019
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  robert.rozee said  I can see VGA support on screens becoming more and more uncommon over the next few years, with the vast majority of monitors only supporting HDMI and composite. after that, composite will start to fade away. which leaves the question: what will we plug our maximites into? will the only games in town become a micromite hooked up to a terminal or a RPi running mmbasic?

There are lots of VGA to HDMI converters around for about five pounds or dollars.  The better ones also allow you to connect an optional audio input as well as the VGA cable, so you can use a HDMI monitor or TV with built-in speakers without having to worry about connecting a separate audio input.  They're just a small (matchbox-size) adapter - they use a 5V supply (and often come with a mains adapter), but if your monitor/TV also has a spare USB connector, you can usually get the 5V to power the adapter from there, so you don't need a separate lead to yet another mains adapter.

You can find them on Amazon, Ebay, ...  Just search for VGA to HDMI.
.
Edited 2019-09-16 00:46 by ceptimus
 
PeterB
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Location: Australia
Posts: 639
Posted: 12:25am 16 Sep 2019
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I think ceptimus is correct. The maximite, being VGA, will go on for ever more or less.
Things like the E64 are limited by their output so will one of you "young" blokes please design a device that plugs into the E64 and outputs HDMI & VGA.
It shouldn't be too hard said he, tongue firmly in cheek.

Peter
 
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