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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : HC-12 old vs new module....
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| Boppa Guru  Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814 |
I've gotten a reply from HC01.com, I've asked them for a direct link to the HC12's selling point or a list of dealers that stock genuine ones, see what I get, fingers x'd (at least the woman I am emailing has good english, so hopefully get a good result from her) I tried an english email to begin with with no reply, so I tried google translating my english email into chinese and sent that, asking if they had anyone who knew english :-) |
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| Andrew_G Guru Joined: 18/10/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 868 |
Paul, not at our age! But we do have a raging open fire going with spuds ready to go in and a new Jaffa iron to test. I'm about to open a good red! Limited electronics this weekend. Andrew |
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Quazee137 Guru Joined: 07/08/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 586 |
Was looking over a few PDF's have a look at page 19 of 2018-05-11_223645_AN633.pdf.zip and page 36 of Si4463-61-60-C.pdf It may be that they can be re-tuned to work as they should be. |
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Grogster Admin Group  Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9498 |
@ Boppa - you're a star.  I should have thought of that myself.  Please keep the forum updated. What we really need, is an English version of their site, so people can order direct from them and we know that we are getting the genuine article then. I don't care one jot if it costs a little more then the eBay or AliExpress ones, cos you would know they are genuine.If possible, can you ask your contact if she can confirm that cloned HC-12's now exist? That's what we all think, but if we could get some kind of confirmation out of hc01.com(in English!), that would seal the deal. @ Andrew_G - Yes, is pretty much winter over here now, and baked spuds are a favourite of mine this time of year. I will probably over-eat on the bloody things....  @ Quazee137 - Yes, I read that too when I was first reading the RF chip PDF. The frequency can be tailored to the crystal you are using. This is further evidence of clones, cos they just COPY the thing, but don't bother to make any adjustments. Had hc01.com actually made some with a different crystal then normal, I fully expect they would have tweaked those registers in the FW, to make them work with the thousands of other ones. Cloners simply don't care about details. I might be jumping to conclusions a little there with that statement, but I fear I am probably not. Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| Quazee137 Guru Joined: 07/08/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 586 |
Well my though was that those who got stuck with clones and might be able to bring them into the right frequencies using that information. Not sure if usage of the clones would be illegal in some places. |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9498 |
Depends on how much trouble you want to go to for a $5 module.  In theory, you should be able to rewrite the registers to correct the frequency issue, but it would involve a lot of effort, making it impractical considering the cost of the things.Use of the clones would only be illegal if the frequency error put you outside of the band you were allowed to operate in. This is actually the case in NZ with the clones, as 458.60MHz is legal, but above 458.61Mhz is not, so the clones being on 458.637MHz or so makes them illegal - on that channel. Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| Boppa Guru Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814 |
Well theres good news and bad news.... Bad news is HC01.com is currently dealing with sales in China only atm Good news is that they are 'thinking' about setting up an english online store possibly, perhaps, maybe... They also have a rather large range of other modules in their lineup too, usb hc12's, bluetooth, wifi, all sorts of fun toys There are definitely clones/fakes out there not being made by HC01.com, real ones have the thick white printing on a blue pcb, and t300 crystals, anything else is not a HC01.com board I am attempting with her help to set up an account atm, and might possibly be able to provide a 'idiots guide to buying hc12s', they do do paypal or direct debit via bank accounts (I'd stick with paypal I think) so if I can figure out what buttons to push and put it in a simple step by step instruction set, you would be able to order directly from them even though its in chinese.... fingers x'd, we'll see if it happens (currently I am stuck on their account section doesnt accept my australian address, I am awaiting a reply on how to 'trick' their system into accepting an aussie address...) |
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palcal Guru Joined: 12/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1965 |
@Boppa... If they were ordered in bulk would it help. Grogster mentioned that he had used 100s. Just thinking maybe Grogs or someone could order say 100 and we could buy of him. I just thought they would be more likely to sell say 100 than in ones and twos. Paul. Edit. Then again I suppose if you see a picture of what you are buying it is a fair bet you would pick the real thing. "It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all" |
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| Boppa Guru Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814 |
They sell in singles or small numbers, but only in China atm I have access to a Chinese reader, plus the email contact speaks (types) English very well I have a literal translation of their ordering page, and am in the process of trying to get an account with them atm, the issue is that their website signup doesnt allow for an overseas address, phone number etc, and is throwing errors at me, I have contacted my email contact and am waiting for a reply to see if either I can be manually entered into their account system, or what format the account data needs to be in to be accepted by their online form. Obviously doing this in a language I dont speak (or read) isnt the easiest thing, but am making some progress, if I am successful, I will (probably) be able to make up a 'cheat sheet' to ordering directly from their website (a click on this button, type this in here type thing with pics etc to make it easy for an english speaker to fill out their forms etc) This is the end point I am aiming for, whether it will be achieved?? who knows... A lot still hasnt been determined about their ordering system (can it post anywhere or only in China via their online shop?? dont know yet, neither does my contact, she doesnt know if it has been done before, they have sent some big orders out manually via email to overseas, but that would obviously require either a large single purchase by one person to resell on, or a group buy as a single bulk order. If we can order via their website in small or single units, that would be the best- short of them actually redesigning it for english users lol |
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| Boppa Guru Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814 |
 Working on something like this- IF I can get their online shop form to accept non Chinese street addresses and phone numbers, and IF they mail out of China via their website... otherwise we would be stuck with bulk ordering and doing it all via email (what they currently have done in the past)- my email contact has confirmed she can (and has) done this before, but being able to order small quantities through the shop direct to the person wanting it would be preferable obviously If we can get it to work that is... |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9498 |
[Quote=Boppa]There are definitely clones/fakes out there not being made by HC01.com, real ones have the thick white printing on a blue pcb, and t300 crystals, anything else is not a HC01.com board[/Quote] This information is very useful indeed. It confirms what most of us thought in the first place, and that is that there ARE cloned HC-12's on the market now. I would be interested in buying a large number of genuine ones from them, and selling them locally on my website. Can you please ask your contact at hc01 what the MOQ(minimum order quantity) is for an order of HC-12's? They are an AWESOME little module - provided you get the genuine ones..... Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| Andrew_G Guru Joined: 18/10/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 868 |
Hi all, well my latest batch of 5 HC-12s arrived and, using Grogs' Tester, I've programmed one to my 2400 / FU2 network. It seems to listen and talk OK to my network. Its crystal is marked 30.000 MHZ, its two holes are almost covered and the silkscreen is a creamy white. By the above discussion it appears to be non-genuine - BUT probably all my others are too - hence they talk to each other. Cheers, Andrew |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9498 |
Yes, that is the 'Gotcha!' All genuine, no problems.  All clones, no problems. MIX them up, big problems.   If you can see the tracks on the bottom of the module through the milky-white silkscreen, and the crystal is marked as either 30.000MHZ or e300, they are most likely fakes. The only way to be really sure, is to audibly listen to them talk on the frequency you programmed with a scanner, or visually with a frequency counter/spectrum analyser - or both. Genuine will be spot-on frequency, clones will not. Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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Chopperp Guru Joined: 03/01/2018 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1090 |
Thanks Mate!!! Ordered some from the same place.  Not arrived yet. As you say, if they talk to each other, should be OK & you've had no problems. I've got no immediate plans for an extensive network but it would good if we could get a "Local" distributor. ChopperP |
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| Andrew_G Guru Joined: 18/10/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 868 |
Thanks Grogs, Yes my existing ones are a mixture of "30.000MHZ" and "e300" (two batches from two old orders) plus my 5 new "30.000MHZ"s. They all seem to talk to each other but I'm now wondering if my need to go to external antennae for anything over 20m instead of the coil to get decent range could be one of the symptoms? My hand held UHF radio is on the way so . . . that will be fun. Cheers, Andrew |
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| pjmart Newbie  Joined: 13/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 9 |
Some further information. I purchased 3x HC-12's back in 2016 which meet the criteria as original(T300 crystals, heavy white silkscreen on the back). Earlier this year I purchased 3x more from a different source only to find they will not communicate with the older ones but work quite happily with their own batch as previously reported by Grogs and others. The silkscreen on the back is quite thin and the crystals are marked 30.000MHZ so I assume they are clones. I don't have any other means of checking frequency. Just after this discussion started I purchased another 3 as replacements, doing as much checking as possible beforehand and they arrived today. On inspection they all have metal encased crystals marked as 30.000MHZ but the back silkscreen is very thick as per my originals. I have now tested all 3 and all talk perfectly with the originals but not with what I think are clones. This now suggests that the T300 marking on the crystal is not an absolute go/no go criteria although the heavy silkscreen coating is. The latest batch was purchased on Ebay (Seller: colortop9). I have just received replacement T300 crystals from Element14 (thanks Grogs) and will try upgrading the clones in the next few days. |
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| Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9498 |
Welcome to the forums. That's interesting, and the first report of a 30.000MHZ marked crystal actually resulting in correct operation. I got the impression that the genuine ones all were marked as T300, as also backed up by the info Boppa has got out of hc01.com  However, it is still useful information to have, so thanks for posting. Can you please look on your ones marked with 30.000MHZ and the thick silkscreen, and see if the Vcc pad is square on the top, but ROUND on the bottom? Genuine seems to do it this way, clones have a square pad top and bottom for Vcc - as well as the thin silkscreen. As the RF chip can be tweaked to suit the crystal in use, hc01.com COULD still use the out-of-spec crystals, provided they tweaked the registers in the RF chip. They may have done just that. The cloners will not have, which is why a direct copy of the original does not work correctly with the out-of-spec crystals the cloners used. Base on your post, I will stop paying as much attention to the crystal from now on, and just concentrate on the thick white silkscreen as being more likely genuine, and if you have a milky see-through silkscreen, they are likely clones. Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops! |
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| pjmart Newbie Joined: 13/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 9 |
The Vcc pads are certainly rounded on the underside and the topside is now obscured by the header. I did look before attaching the header and think that the top pad was rounded although cannot be 100% sure. Have attached photos.   |
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| palcal Guru Joined: 12/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1965 |
I have 2 HC-12's talking to one another, both seem to have the thick white silk screen but one has the www.hc01.com and HC-12 on the bottom and the other one only has the arrow type logo like the one next to the crystal in pjmart's photo. They both have T300 crystals. During my working days we imported a lot of things from China (mostly whitegoods), I did testing R&D and repairs and would find subtle differences in the same Model. I came to the conclusion that the company that designed the product would distribute their blueprint to different factories to have them made, and so the different factories did things slightly differently. They make these products by the million and maybe the one factory can't handle the volume of work. Maybe this could explain differences in two legitimate items. Paul. "It is better to be ignorant and ask a stupid question than to be plain Stupid and not ask at all" |
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| Boppa Guru Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814 |
Have a look at the genuine hc thread, I suspect what you have is a HC01.com HC12 and a clone HC12 (not a fake) The fakes that give the trouble are marked with the HC01.com on the back, like the real one, but are off frequency, the clones (so far) seem to be just that, a copy, but dont pretend to be from HC01.com |
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